American Cancer Society refusing to allow FBB to participate as a group in the Relay For Life? (souls, Christian)
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I don't know... One of the things I can't stand about religion is that it stops at nothing to advertise itself as this "wonderful" program designed to help other human beings out. As one would expect, this sort of thing doesn't come "strings-free" but rather with the caveat of having those most in need and those most vulnerable being fed a belief system while they're being taken care of. I've always wondered why Christian charities and missions can't just go somewhere, build a school, a hospital, or feed the sick and not advertise their faith. What's wrong with simply helping someone? What's wrong with simply donating to charity anonymously?
I'm happy to hear that a group of atheists wanted to donate money to a cause for the greater good. But, I don't believe it should be necessary to advertise WHO donated the money, how it was donated, or why it was donated. The mere fact that a half million dollars is going to a good cause should be sufficient enough for every participant of the FBB to get that sense of satisfaction. Public recognition or not.
I always question the motives of people and organizations that wish to make their contributions well known. It makes me wonder if there is really a basis of altruism behind the action or if it serves a different purpose. It's somewhat on the same lines of asking if a corporation would donate to various charities if tax breaks weren't a part of it.
Don't get me wrong, I can understand why the FBB got a little annoyed but the adamancy of being recognized seems to be a little suspicious. It does have a certain reek of something a little more than basic human altruism behind it and that drives me away.
I never rule out the selfish motives of those performing tasks considered unselfish and charitable.
Well, you can bet the American Cancer Society doesn't mind when a Christian organization identifies itself as such. I don't understand why a non-belief group raises so many hackles simply by existing. Its money given for a worthy cause should be as good as anyone's.
Did you just SERIOUSLY compare banning smoking in restaurants to an atheist being denied the same rights and privileges as a religious person? God damn, that's an inconceivable stretch.
No. It's a bit of a stretch to say that I was comparing "banning smoking in restaurants" to "an atheist being denied the same rights and privileges as a religious person", I think. No, I didn't compare them in a strict sense.
If you review it carefully, you'll find that I was pointing out that the American Cancer Society's reputation for acting in it's own self-interest (to the detriment of other groups of people) is already well-known. In fact - I'm pretty sure I wrote that in my post. So any comparison that is going on is with their behavior and reputation.
As for the supposed comparison - it could be done, if one's personal bias was gotten rid of. It wouldn't be a strict analogy - but some of the details would definately match. Wherever denied rights are concerned, one can make some sort of comparison. Should a business have the right to appeal to a certain group of customers - or donators? Or should the government stipulate such things for them, no matter how it affects their business?
I don't know... One of the things I can't stand about religion is that it stops at nothing to advertise itself as this "wonderful" program designed to help other human beings out. As one would expect, this sort of thing doesn't come "strings-free" but rather with the caveat of having those most in need and those most vulnerable being fed a belief system while they're being taken care of. I've always wondered why Christian charities and missions can't just go somewhere, build a school, a hospital, or feed the sick and not advertise their faith. What's wrong with simply helping someone? What's wrong with simply donating to charity anonymously?
I'm happy to hear that a group of atheists wanted to donate money to a cause for the greater good. But, I don't believe it should be necessary to advertise WHO donated the money, how it was donated, or why it was donated. The mere fact that a half million dollars is going to a good cause should be sufficient enough for every participant of the FBB to get that sense of satisfaction. Public recognition or not.
I always question the motives of people and organizations that wish to make their contributions well known. It makes me wonder if there is really a basis of altruism behind the action or if it serves a different purpose. It's somewhat on the same lines of asking if a corporation would donate to various charities if tax breaks weren't a part of it.
Don't get me wrong, I can understand why the FBB got a little annoyed but the adamancy of being recognized seems to be a little suspicious. It does have a certain reek of something a little more than basic human altruism behind it and that drives me away.
I never rule out the selfish motives of those performing tasks considered unselfish and charitable.
Amen!
Too many people wish their good deeds to be known by others - or they won't perform any. This has been common for christian charities, but when atheists start down this road it becomes harder and harder to declare that morality and ethics are possible without religion. The christians start winning that argument, once they realize their opponents are now acting just... like... them.
Here is what the American Cancer Society has to say about this:
"The FBB are liars" haha. Anyone here from the FBB want to clarify? Is the ACS truly secular? or over-run with corrupt religionists?
It seems most of these non-FBB people couldn't care less about the dignity of the people of FBB and atheists with cancer. Hitchens should have something to say about that.
It seems to me that if the FBB wants to join the (Special Interest) National *Corporate* Team Program they are doing it simply for publicity reasons... are any Religious organizations in the National Team Program?
I don't want to continue thinking that the leaders of the ACS are corrupt corporate pawns. Then again, corporations would never help if they weren't recognized... is this what the FBB would do? I suspect not... hopefully. We shall see which of the two organizations is more corrupt.
I don't know... One of the things I can't stand about religion is that it stops at nothing to advertise itself as this "wonderful" program designed to help other human beings out. As one would expect, this sort of thing doesn't come "strings-free" but rather with the caveat of having those most in need and those most vulnerable being fed a belief system while they're being taken care of. I've always wondered why Christian charities and missions can't just go somewhere, build a school, a hospital, or feed the sick and not advertise their faith. What's wrong with simply helping someone? What's wrong with simply donating to charity anonymously?
I'm happy to hear that a group of atheists wanted to donate money to a cause for the greater good. But, I don't believe it should be necessary to advertise WHO donated the money, how it was donated, or why it was donated. The mere fact that a half million dollars is going to a good cause should be sufficient enough for every participant of the FBB to get that sense of satisfaction. Public recognition or not.
I always question the motives of people and organizations that wish to make their contributions well known. It makes me wonder if there is really a basis of altruism behind the action or if it serves a different purpose. It's somewhat on the same lines of asking if a corporation would donate to various charities if tax breaks weren't a part of it.
Don't get me wrong, I can understand why the FBB got a little annoyed but the adamancy of being recognized seems to be a little suspicious. It does have a certain reek of something a little more than basic human altruism behind it and that drives me away.
I never rule out the selfish motives of those performing tasks considered unselfish and charitable.
yeah... or it could have something to do with the dignity of its members... you never know.
I'd like to see their lists from previous years... but it seems they have shred them.
here is a link for the application... it is not limited to corporate beasts. So does this mean that the ACS were afraid that the FBB would end up right up there with AT&T and Target... leaving the Religious organizations that applied in awe of how little they were able to raise themselves as compared to capitalist and atheist organizations?
If I were a leader in the FBB, I would consider having a very good check and record of the corporation?'s donations, but would also consider my pity for how hard it must be for the religious organizations to raise money for cancer research. With the humiliation of Religionists in mind, I would ask the ACS to withdraw or brand? or club? from the National Raiser's List. Since seeing how dirty and poor their homes are, might negatively affect the self-esteem of religionists... or they might rejoice that their members aren't rich? idk.
Do religious corporations simply not raise as much as the Foundation Beyond Belief (obviously a foundation, so likely a corporation)?
Last edited by LuminousTruth; 09-27-2011 at 10:41 PM..
That reminded me of how the ACS doesn't seem to want to be associated with the FBB.
Are these organizations and clubs really in the National Team Program?:
Girl Scouts of America
Family, Career, and Community Leaders of America
Phi Theta Kappa National Honors Society
Sigma Alpha Lambda
Technology Student Association
These are considered "Corporations" but FBB isn't? If you read the application, you don't have to be a corporation, it's just that capitalist organizations are usually the only ones capable of raising up to halve a million I think. This is likely going to change now that t.v. evangelists heard about this... We shall see who are better Capitalists/Mercantilists the atheist vs. religious organizations.
Last edited by LuminousTruth; 09-28-2011 at 12:03 AM..
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