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Old 09-21-2011, 01:18 PM
 
4,480 posts, read 4,223,664 times
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Why do many theists continue to rail against what they see as attacks against them from secular sources. If theists would practice what they preach they would be railing against the intolerance coming from their own camps. Like the continued bulling of children due to their sexual orientation. Gay people face discrimination on a daily basis and it's not coming from secular sources. How about some posts or threads aimed at fellow theists condemning intolerance of gays because of religion? How many more children do we have to loose before we put aside this petty BS and get down to what's important?

Teenager struggled with bullying before taking his life - Schools - The Buffalo News (http://www.buffalonews.com/city/schools/article563538.ece - broken link)

A question for theists:

Have you talked to your children about their peers that may be homosexual? What did you tell them?
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Old 09-21-2011, 04:24 PM
 
Location: playing in the colorful Colorado dirt
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My daughter has several gay/bi friends. She's gone to school with them for years and has accepted her friends based on who they are, not what they are. This is how she was taught.

I wish more people had been taught the same way.

Gay bashing isn't religion specific. People from all walks of life engage in it. I'm not Christian but I don't think that they should be singled out when so many others are just as guilty.
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Old 09-21-2011, 05:32 PM
 
4,480 posts, read 4,223,664 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pamelaBeurman View Post
My daughter has several gay/bi friends. She's gone to school with them for years and has accepted her friends based on who they are, not what they are. This is how she was taught.

I wish more people had been taught the same way.

Gay bashing isn't religion specific. People from all walks of life engage in it. I'm not Christian but I don't think that they should be singled out when so many others are just as guilty.

If you don't believe that gays are discriminated against in this country due to religious beliefs then your fooling yourself. I don't believe that I ever singled out a particular religion. I think all of them need realize that they don't have insight on the right way to live anymore that anyone else. But I'm thankful you've taught your children tolerance and acceptance.
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Old 09-22-2011, 04:36 AM
 
Location: 30-40N 90-100W
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I was actually thinking this might be about the topic of useful dialogue, but it's kind of another "let's bash traditional Christians" deal. (The "theist" term is used, but belief in God doesn't necessarily say anything about one's view of homosexuality)

I believe homosexual sex to be a sin, and as I've made clear not because of Leviticus or because it's something I'd never be tempted to try, but if I had kids I certainly wouldn't want them to attack or bully anyone for having non-Abrahamic beliefs. Not Hindus, Buddhists, Wicca, Atheists, Gays, or even Scientologists. If they had same-sex attractions themselves, as I do, I'd try to explain to them what we believe that means. Then, if after 18, they decide to be homosexually active I'd probably be disappointed but understand it's their choice. (The action being their choice, not the orientation) Also I'd hopefully treat them as I would if they had heterosexually "shacked-up" with someone or married a divorced person who had no annulment.

Judging from my past experience this perspective would place me, for my generation, as a horrible bigot condemning a hypothetical child to misery. Although considering I'm not miserable, despite some gay people's attempt to tell me I must be, I clearly don't buy that. I think I would likely be a bit more understanding than some from earlier generations to be honest, although it would be an odd experience if I had a son who also had SSAs.
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Old 09-22-2011, 09:36 AM
 
Location: OKC
5,426 posts, read 5,573,729 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas R. View Post
I was actually thinking this might be about the topic of useful dialogue, but it's kind of another "let's bash traditional Christians" deal. (The "theist" term is used, but belief in God doesn't necessarily say anything about one's view of homosexuality)

I believe homosexual sex to be a sin, and as I've made clear not because of Leviticus or because it's something I'd never be tempted to try, but if I had kids I certainly wouldn't want them to attack or bully anyone for having non-Abrahamic beliefs. Not Hindus, Buddhists, Wicca, Atheists, Gays, or even Scientologists. If they had same-sex attractions themselves, as I do, I'd try to explain to them what we believe that means. Then, if after 18, they decide to be homosexually active I'd probably be disappointed but understand it's their choice. (The action being their choice, not the orientation) Also I'd hopefully treat them as I would if they had heterosexually "shacked-up" with someone or married a divorced person who had no annulment.

Judging from my past experience this perspective would place me, for my generation, as a horrible bigot condemning a hypothetical child to misery. Although considering I'm not miserable, despite some gay people's attempt to tell me I must be, I clearly don't buy that. I think I would likely be a bit more understanding than some from earlier generations to be honest, although it would be an odd experience if I had a son who also had SSAs.

If all theist were like you Thomas this world would be a much better place. Unfortunately there are other rabid evangelicals out there, and it's hard for me to argue against them without casting a net so wide that it doesn't also unintionally capture people like you.

There language we have to argue with is insufficient, or I'm insuffiently skilled at using it.
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Old 09-22-2011, 11:59 AM
 
12,447 posts, read 14,587,292 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikebnllnb View Post
Why do many theists continue to rail against what they see as attacks against them from secular sources. If theists would practice what they preach they would be railing against the intolerance coming from their own camps. Like the continued bulling of children due to their sexual orientation. Gay people face discrimination on a daily basis and it's not coming from secular sources. How about some posts or threads aimed at fellow theists condemning intolerance of gays because of religion? How many more children do we have to loose before we put aside this petty BS and get down to what's important?

Teenager struggled with bullying before taking his life - Schools - The Buffalo News (http://www.buffalonews.com/city/schools/article563538.ece - broken link)

A question for theists:

Have you talked to your children about their peers that may be homosexual? What did you tell them?
What's to tell them??All my children have learned to pick there own friends based on trust, loyalty, and respect.......sexual preference has nothing to do with it.....nor does religion.
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Old 09-22-2011, 01:32 PM
 
Location: playing in the colorful Colorado dirt
4,486 posts, read 4,336,174 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikebnllnb View Post
If you don't believe that gays are discriminated against in this country due to religious beliefs then your fooling yourself. I don't believe that I ever singled out a particular religion. I think all of them need realize that they don't have insight on the right way to live anymore that anyone else. But I'm thankful you've taught your children tolerance and acceptance.
That's not what I said. Hell, fundamentalists are among the worst when it comes to homophobia. What I said was it isn't limited just to the religious wrong. It's present in all walks of life.

My brother is gay, didn't change anything when he came out. We were taught that people are people and that judging them based on what "group" they belong to is wrong. That's how we raised our children as well.

Granted, I don't follow my own teachings when it comes to Fundy's but that's because I have yet to meet an open minded one. I'm still looking though, i'm an optimist.

Please, read my OP again.
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