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Old 10-14-2011, 02:45 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,038 posts, read 30,691,572 times
Reputation: 12214

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The thing is, most atheists were once religious as I myself was, and before leaving Christianity was when I made my assessment of it. Following that I researched many other religions trying to find one that was not just a bunch of made up stories...I failed to find one...This is an experience that many atheists undoubtedly share...

You think you understand atheists, but I ask you; have you ever walked in our shoes, as we have in yours?

Quote:
The real danger of our continued indulgence of religion, however, is not terrorism or religious conflict. Without religious divisions, human beings would still have plenty of reasons to make war on each other. Without religion, there would still be racialism, classism, nationalism and — the original motive for war — resource competition.

Rather, the real problem is that our indulgence of irrational belief and willful credulity creates an environment in which those willfully deluded by self-interest can block reasonable, scientifically grounded steps to ensure our long-term well-being.
Blind faith leads to a destructive environment « Old Gold & Black
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Old 10-14-2011, 05:13 PM
 
Location: Washingtonville
2,506 posts, read 1,934,046 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
The thing is, most atheists were once religious as I myself was, and before leaving Christianity was when I made my assessment of it. Following that I researched many other religions trying to find one that was not just a bunch of made up stories...I failed to find one...This is an experience that many atheists undoubtedly share...

You think you understand atheists, but I ask you; have you ever walked in our shoes, as we have in yours?

Blind faith leads to a destructive environment « Old Gold & Black
Actually, I have walked in your shoes. In a way I still am. I don't believe in God(s), I do however believe in something more than this life. I don't worship it, pray to it, or tithe anything for it. I honor nature by not taking from it more than I need. Returning what I can to it, and yes thanking it for giving me life.

By all definitions, I am an atheist. Atheists can have faith, they just can't believe in God(s). Buddhists are atheists... I practice many buddhist teachings. In a way I am a religious mutt, a mix of many.

For sometime, I actually did not believe in anything and brushed it all off. After a few years of this, I started noticing things, and learning more about various philosophies and religions. I came to the conclusion that this life is more than meets the eye. I can't put a label on it, name it, or claim it. I just know in my heart and brain that it's there. It doesn't treat or reward anyone for believing, tithing, worshiping, or converting. It's just there. It has it's laws that work like/with the laws of nature.
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Old 10-15-2011, 12:34 AM
 
Location: Washingtonville
2,506 posts, read 1,934,046 times
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Here's the bottom line, faith has no downside. Faith has a simple definition as we have seen. What makes it complicated is the human factor. Take something that is meant to have a beautiful meaning, add mankind to it and you will have some that use it for bad things.

The funny thing is, we have faith in things everyday. When your driving, you trust that the people you share the road with are sober and know how to drive. This is faith. Trust or belief without evidence.
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Old 10-15-2011, 12:53 AM
 
2,031 posts, read 2,296,446 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raison_d'etre View Post
Here's the bottom line, faith has no downside. Faith has a simple definition as we have seen. What makes it complicated is the human factor. Take something that is meant to have a beautiful meaning, add mankind to it and you will have some that use it for bad things.

The funny thing is, we have faith in things everyday. When your driving, you trust that the people you share the road with are sober and know how to drive. This is faith. Trust or belief without evidence.
No, I don't.

What I know is, statistically, most drivers won't swerve into my lane. But I watch, just the same. I know most drivers will stop at the stop signs and red lights. It's not faith, it's just a statistical observation. Most do. But I watch, because occasionally one doesn't. When I'm slowly down in the highway, coming up on the turn into my house, I watch the vehicles approaching from behind very carefully, making sure they take to the bypass lane. I have no faith that they will. On the contrary, I am acutely aware that they might not. This is why I pay such close attention to them in the rear-view mirror. I know full well that when I commute to work and drive amongst thousands of vehicles that, it is all but certain that some will be intoxicated, some will be texting, some will be otherwise distracted.

If I had the faith you suggest, I'd never look in the rear-view mirror. I'd never warily watch the vehicle driving alongside me on the freeway. I'd never track the speed of the car approaching the red-light while I approach the green-light at the same intersection.

When I have to lock up the brakes because some clown blows a red-light, it is precisely my lack of faith that he was going to stop which provides me the opportunity to avoid a potentially catastrophic accident.
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Old 10-15-2011, 01:30 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,038 posts, read 30,691,572 times
Reputation: 12214
Quote:
Originally Posted by raison_d'etre View Post
Here's the bottom line, faith has no downside. Faith has a simple definition as we have seen. What makes it complicated is the human factor. Take something that is meant to have a beautiful meaning, add mankind to it and you will have some that use it for bad things.

The funny thing is, we have faith in things everyday. When your driving, you trust that the people you share the road with are sober and know how to drive. This is faith. Trust or belief without evidence.
I believe that the topic of the OP was religious faith, but you are moving the goal posts...Religious faith is belief either without evidence or with evidence to the contrary..

Nevertheless, I do not have faith that other people will always drive correctly, or do the correct thing in other matters...If I relied on faith while driving, I doubt if I'd last very long with all the poor drivers on the roads...I hope you don't drive with faith in other drivers...That is not a very smart thing to be doing these days.
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Old 10-15-2011, 01:32 AM
 
Location: southern california
55,237 posts, read 72,453,647 times
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dawkins is a pretty negative person. w/o hope many give up and fail. defeatist attitude is a major counseling issue and a major enemy to management in business as well as in sports.
hope, faith, positive attitude, positive imaging, is in fact a critical productive human trait.
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Old 10-15-2011, 01:34 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,038 posts, read 30,691,572 times
Reputation: 12214
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
dawkins is a pretty negative person.
Really? I know he is negative about religion, but what else is he negative about?
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