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Old 10-21-2011, 09:33 AM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
7,658 posts, read 7,464,108 times
Reputation: 3244

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas R. View Post
I think what he/she means is that atheism does not have any values in itself. Atheism is a description of what one isn't, not what one is.

Not that atheists have no values. They just get their values from what they do believe rather than from what they don't.

Atheism, in itself, is just not very interesting or worth discussing because it's a position on one issue. A crucial issue for many of us, but still just one issue. (Although I think most atheists here are Rationalists and Metaphysical Naturalists which gives a bit more to discuss)

Precisely, Thomas. I'm a "he", BTW.

What I *do* find fascinating is the apparent need of a lot of theists, on this board and out in the real world, to try to force a value system or moral code on atheists as a whole.
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Old 10-21-2011, 09:15 PM
 
16,301 posts, read 24,240,875 times
Reputation: 8261
Quote:
Originally Posted by hooligan View Post
I absolutely do. I wonder if you realize what I said.

Atheists have no necessary consensus of values or morality, despite how much theists would like to imply we do.
Their ignorance is simply astounding, the atrocities committed in the name of your murderous god far exceed what is acceptable to any atheist.

You can train a dog by severe punishment for misbehavior, and while it will stop the behavior it creates a very dangerous animal as a result. This is the same moral training you apparently have in your fear of your murderous and irrational god, purely fear based behavior control.

While about 15% of the US population are atheist, only 0.2% of the prison population are atheist.

Last edited by Asheville Native; 10-21-2011 at 09:42 PM..
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Old 10-21-2011, 09:39 PM
 
Location: OKC
5,426 posts, read 5,571,236 times
Reputation: 1760
Hold your fire, Ash, we have friendlies in the area.

We have blue-on-blue casualties.
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Old 10-21-2011, 09:44 PM
 
16,301 posts, read 24,240,875 times
Reputation: 8261
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxcar Overkill View Post
Hold your fire, Ash, we have friendlies in the area.

We have blue-on-blue casualties.
My bad, but I edited to correct my aim

OBTW, it gray-on-gray around here
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Old 10-21-2011, 10:31 PM
 
Location: Beautiful Niagara Falls ON.
10,024 posts, read 10,143,144 times
Reputation: 8868
I'm a Christian and to tell you the truth. I'm not concerned about the sins of others. I have a hard enough time trying to deal with my own.

I'm sure that not many of you know that the Church is not called to say, teach or do anything about the sins of those who are not Christians. The bible tells us that our mission is to preach the gospel of Jesus Christ to the world. God uses this "good news" to convict people of their sins and the action of the Holy spirit deals with the sin in these now regenerate people.

The only real condemnation that Jesus preached in the bible was to those religous leaders who's practise was what? Their practise was to condemn people for their sins and thinking they recieved some kind of merit in the eyes of God for their works.

Jesus said to them. "Why do you try to take the splinter from your brother's eye when you have a plank in your own".

I'm just a sinner saved by grace and like the Apostle Paul I can look at myself and say, "I am the chief of sinners". The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. Thanks be to God who saved one such as I.
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Old 10-22-2011, 09:19 AM
 
14,920 posts, read 10,727,888 times
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Ahh - the old love the sinner hate the sin routine. It's simply a way to justify your hate and re-brand it as love. Sick and twisted logic.
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Old 10-22-2011, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Southern NC
1,917 posts, read 4,227,224 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hammertime33 View Post
Ahh - the old hate the sin lover the sinner routine. It's just a way to justify your hate and rebrand it as love. Sick and twisted logic.
I agree...it's like me saying hate the Christian, love the person...or something like that. lol!
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Old 10-22-2011, 03:08 PM
 
Location: Beautiful Niagara Falls ON.
10,024 posts, read 10,143,144 times
Reputation: 8868
Quote:
Originally Posted by hammertime33 View Post
Ahh - the old love the sinner hate the sin routine. It's simply a way to justify your hate and re-brand it as love. Sick and twisted logic.
I don't think you understand the concept. I hate sin and what it does to us all. I hate my own sins especially.
The doctorine of "Sin" is poorly understood, even among many Christians. It absolutely gives us no reason to dislike anyone. If you are pointing your finger at some one, just remember you have all the rest of your fingers pointing right at your self.

The thing that bothers me the most about the way Christians do not understand about sin and sinners is the way they pick out some particular sin and make that some kind of crusade.
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Old 10-22-2011, 03:15 PM
 
9,415 posts, read 11,281,002 times
Reputation: 20186
What is sin really? Being human seems to be a major issue for christians. And what are we saved from? The very god who created us frail and imperfect. Ridiculous beyond belief that a perfect god could make such a major screw up creating his precious human beings.

I don't believe in sin, I view my faults and simply normal human behaviour. Cheating, lying, murdering, raping etc is against the law that we as people have created to control and navigate living as a society.

The concept as sin in the bible is used to control people and keep them feeling guilty, nothing more.
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