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The "mind" is just chemical reactions in the brain. Nothing more, nothing less. Cold, hard biology.
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Originally Posted by Asheville Native
Pretty much it, and that really comes home when people fantasize about and after life and the other impossible promises religion creates.
Reality may bite at times, but it's all we got, but I'm good with that.
What humans are willing to accept in support of their preferred worldview is amazing. Rejecting as non-existent our very personhood as mere chemical reactions is beyond reason . . . it is insane.
What humans are willing to accept in support of their preferred worldview is amazing. Rejecting as non-existent our very personhood as mere chemical reactions is beyond reason . . . it is insane.
Says the man that believes in the absurdity of sky gods and the other mindless nonsense associated with them.
Says the man that believes in the absurdity of sky gods and the other mindless nonsense associated with them.
I could almost make an exception and believe that I am talking to mere chemical reactions when addressing your posts, Ashe . . . but even your posts are far more than mere chemical reactions!
You mean there are lots of atheists who agree with you and they use the Internet?
No. I tend to mean exactly what I said. Not what you pretend I said. Clearly given my posting history on this forum I have enough of my own words without you putting some in my mouth for me.
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Originally Posted by Thomas R.
Anyway looking it up I'll concede Catholics as a percent of the world's population has gone down since 1985. Although it looks to be stable since 1995.
And a good thing too as they are certainly on the top of my list of the most awful, damaging and evil religions. I am not sure how stable they are on a country by country basis however with Ireland seeing people leaving the RCC in droves, Italy and Spain showing drop offs too, Ireland unable to fill the seminaries with enough vocations, and after normalising for deaths and births there was this year a first ever net loss in membership in Germany. All very promising signs. I may not see the death of religion in my life time given how slow the death is, but I would very much appreciate being around to witness the death throes of the Catholic Church.
There are still some days when I can't believe that people really, really believe in all of the Bible with their whole heart. I never did. The only thing that scared the crap outta me was being set on fire for eternity. That held me in place for a very long time.
I read recently that we do indeed tend to believe something more readily if the person telling us that something cause us to fear in some way. We are more open to baseless ideas if those ideas are presented in such a fashion as to allay fears.
Religion is good at adapting and it has evolved itself to be very good at using facts about the human condition to spread itself. It very much utilises the fear of people in order to sell itself.
I remember a guy coming to me in the street in Dublin with the "good news" and I told him I had no interest. He started telling me about hell and fire and brimestone and I would suffer with agony. I hailed over a local police officer and had the guy questioned for threatening me.
Comical, but also relevant. At the end of the day these people are selling a product and they are literally threatening people in order to sell it. That IS illegal and it is about time more people start applying the law to it.
There was a story recently in Wales where a man was arrested for calling a woman and "english *****" or something similar in the heat of argument. Yet priests can get up on the pulpit and deride whole sections of our society... like gay people... premeditated... and threaten people with things like hell... and no law is enacted. I would like to see that change.
This appeal to the unknown and unexplained - in respect of human though, just here - is surely overdone. The appeal to complexity, the argument from ignorance and ignoring so many similar questions that turned out to be much better answered by materialist naturalist explanations. There are, I believe, some indications that human thought has to be a product of the brain. The cells and electrical impulses Damage the brain and the impulses don't work very well or at all.
You'd think that was simple enough but, no, we still get the appeals to the unexplained. At best. More often we just get a lot of abuse for not swallowing a lot of speculation as some sort of definite fact.
Apparently the thread had degenerated, (as they often do) into trying to ague for a believable 'god' (which our OP agnostic would still give some sort of credit to) not just as a possibility or even a probability but as something which should be so plainly ewvidennt that we ought to take it a fact.
So at least it's on topic as I think there are very good reasons why agnosticism is the only reasonable, logical and rational knowledge - position to hold in respect of gods or anything one might suppose deserves the 'god' label.
I'm not sure I believe in God or not. That's the problem. But I have no other explanation (apparently I need one) for how we got here and how the universe was created. But like I said, I need time to research different viewpoints and see what I come up with. And yes, I always had the freedom to research anything I wanted, I was just afraid to. There is no "freedom in religion" when you're full of fear and too afraid to even hear other ideas for fear of losing your religion. Happened anyway.
Yep, I'm done listening to men about what a God would have me do or not do so if I want to behave like an earthworm I can do so. And you're right, I feel if there is a God and he wants me to believe in him and do his bidding he would reveal himself to me. That's pretty much all that any of us non-believers need.
That is no reason to believe in a god....just because you can't come up with another explanation for something! How is that belief anyway? I know for me, my beliefs are arrived at based on being convinced of something's truth. It seems like you are grasping at straws trying to find some reason that would justify a belief in god. However, using the word "belief" for something just because you can't come up with another explanation does not sound like someone who is convinced of something.
What is wrong with "I don't know?" Because in actuality, that is the only truthful answer...that you do not know. Otherwise, you are just using god as placeholder ("god of the gaps") for that which has not yet been explained.
Yeah this is all new to me so like I said before, I think I believe in a God/Creator that is love and light but that's as far as it goes. Universal Reconciliation taught me that if there is a God, he is not the monster portrayed in the Bible. I don't trust or believe the Bible, so I'm not sure where that leaves me. I can't be classified as a "Christian" any longer I suppose because I'm even questioning the deity of the Christ and the whole story of his death and resurrection. So, I guess agnostic is appropriate for now because I do question the God of the Bible and all that entails.
That's exactly what I believe in too, Ilene. I grew up being a diehard atheist. Kind of cool that a Christian and an atheist could end up believing the same thing.
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And you're right, I feel if there is a God and he wants me to believe in him and do his bidding he would reveal himself to me. That's pretty much all that any of us non-believers need.
