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Well theres your problem right there. You are unwilling to even consider an idea that is not your own. You are closed minded. How can you rule something out that you have not and are not willing to consider. I guess you have your answers already. This is futile. Goodnight.
I beg your pardon, until last month I firmly didnot believe in evolution; yet I suddenly saw something I had not seen before, in debate here with several people. Unlike many believers in God, I believe God created primordal man, and I think he did let them evolve , he was " Tinkering with them." But the evolution stopped with Adam, the first human God gave consciousness, or the first man created in Gods image.
That was not my idea. But it is now.
Now conversely, can you give me an example of a Theist here changing your mind?
Speak for yourself, I am not the product of the idiot hierarchies of speechless apes. Nor will my mind accept that all the creatures on earth are products of chemicals that crawled out from under a rock.
LOL....But you ARE a species of ape, like it or not...You are wrong about almost everything, as a matter of fact, but you do entertain me, because I never know what's coming next.
I beg your pardon, until last month I firmly didnot believe in evolution; yet I suddenly saw something I had not seen before, in debate here with several people. Unlike many believers in God, I believe God created primordal man, and I think he did let them evolve , he was " Tinkering with them." But the evolution stopped with Adam, the first human God gave consciousness, or the first man created in Gods image.
That was not my idea. But it is now.
Now conversely, can you give me an example of a Theist here changing your mind?
Oh by the way; pleasant dreams.
How is this believing in evolution? By the way I seem to remember you making the same erroneous statement on one of your other threads...
Consciousness cannot create itself, it must be created. Consciousness is " A Spirit in humans", which is why it has no central location within the body; its just there! There is nothing physical in the body that we can call a conscious organ. There is nothing in the brain other than tissue of one sort or another. Nothing physical in man accounts for consciousness. Science has tried to masquerade the brain as the costume of consciousness , that is complettely false.
Consciousness is not psychological phenomena, or neuro-anatomy and chemistry. Consciousness is the breath of life that God blew into man's
dead body. Consciousness is the image of God.
You're using a lot of metaphysical language there for someone who is set on "proving" God. If you're going to use metaphysical language, why even bother proving him?
If we cannot define our terms and agree on them, there's really no point in having a discussion. As I said in my post, your "definition" of consciousness is not one that is commonly held, accepted or verifiable - and it's biased to begin with to reach the conclusion you wish.
I don't know if YOU see the problem with such an approach, but the rest of the participants in this thread grasp the problem. You've spent pages upon pages defending your own quirky definition, and I don't think anyone has accepted it yet. It would be a different matter if your "definition" was persuasive, but it is not - and that is how one makes a point: by being persuasive. You may have persuaded yourself that your defintion is a viable one, but it's really not - and that stalls the entire argument. You haven't noticed the strong rejection of your "definition" in the thread?
How is this believing in evolution? By the way I seem to remember you making the same erroneous statement on one of your other threads...
Well its a new belief for me, I don't rightly know how to describe it. I think primordal man could have very well went through an evolution, by Gods design. I think I have been wrong about that, but I certainly know the evolution stopped when primordal man ceased to exist.
You're using a lot of metaphysical language there for someone who is set on "proving" God. If you're going to use metaphysical language, why even bother proving him?
If we cannot define our terms and agree on them, there's really no point in having a discussion. As I said in my post, your "definition" of consciousness is not one that is commonly held, accepted or verifiable - and it's biased to begin with to reach the conclusion you wish.
I don't know if YOU see the problem with such an approach, but the rest of the participants in this thread grasp the problem. You've spent pages upon pages defending your own quirky definition, and I don't think anyone has accepted it yet. It would be a different matter if your "definition" was persuasive, but it is not - and that is how one makes a point: by being persuasive. You may have persuaded yourself that your defintion is a viable one, but it's really not - and that stalls the entire argument. You haven't noticed the strong rejection of your "definition" in the thread?
I am not set on proving God, I am set that there is proof of God, and I have noticed that no matter how much I say this here, nobody seems to understand that difference. I am not forcing discussion out of anyone here. I simply post my views as you do. And I have defined consciousness so many times in so many ways, I am surprised that you would say such a thing to me" Quirky definition."
Let me be more Quirky then; We can only be conscious of those things we are conscious of. In being conscious of consciousness , we feel it is the most self-evident thing imaginable. We " Feel" it is the defining attribute of all our waking states, our moods and affections, our memorys, our thoughts , attentions and volitions. We " Feel" comfortably certain that consciousness is the basics of concepts , of learning and reasoning, of thought and judgement, and that is so because it records and stores our experiences as they happen, allowing us to introspect on them and learn from them as well. We also " Feel" quite conscious that all this wonderful set of operations and contents that we call consciousness is located in the head.
On my critical examination, all of those statements are false! They are the costume that consciousness has been masquerading in for centuries. They are all misconceptions that have prevented a solution to the problem of the orgin of consciousness.
I know what you are talking about. You don't always feel this...but every now and then I feel this distinct feeling of consciousness. It's hard to explain. It's just that you exist.
I don't think it can "prove" the existence of God. I don't think you can prove consciousness is anything other than cognitive ability or reasoning.
I know what you are talking about. You don't always feel this...but every now and then I feel this distinct feeling of consciousness. It's hard to explain. It's just that you exist.
I don't think it can "prove" the existence of God. I don't think you can prove consciousness is anything other than cognitive ability or reasoning.
What you feel is the program God downloaded into you; its called a Spirit. That Spirit is the real you, and its a creation of God, it didnot create itself. And its one of the best ways to " Try and communicate with God'", its also how God communicates with humans, when he rarely does that. Its also that part of you that is destined for things beyond what you know now. Everything about you, is in your Spirit. Your body is just carrying it around. That Spirit is Life; its what keeps you alive. When it leaves your body will die.
Evolution and nature does not have the intelligence to create consciousness; creation requires intelligence and power. Evolution is not intelligent, its not a power, its not a being; its a theory; theory cannot create consciousness.
And I am not trying to prove anything, I am saying there is proof.
I grew up learning and believing this...that our body was like a glove to our spirit. Now I find myself questioning everything I believe. But I cannot bring myself to say my spirit/soul is not eternal. It just seems like a truth.
But I also think you would have to say "everything" living has a spirit.
I grew up learning and believing this...that our body was like a glove to our spirit. Now I find myself questioning everything I believe. But I cannot bring myself to say my spirit/soul is not eternal. It just seems like a truth.
But I also think you would have to say "everything" living has a spirit.
I think the Spirit is eternal, yet another proof of God and his eternity;our spirit is an integral part of him, we are his actual offspring. I would agree that the body is like a glove , the Spirit just fits into it, the whole body, not just our head. Everything living has a Spirit of life, but not everything has the spirit of consciousness . I do not believe that animals are conscious, as we are conscious. Consciousness is just not important in animals.
In my view, God saw no need to give animals consciousness. And they don't need it to survive, only instincts are needed for survival.
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