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Old 03-08-2012, 07:57 AM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 21,941,988 times
Reputation: 2226

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
WOW!

This thread sure has the hackles of the atheists up in arms.

(most telling)

If it's just bunk, ignore it. It will go away. That's what I do when it comes to the fables of the atheist camp.
Makes one wonder if that is not what many or most of the early non-believers did...Ignore it, hoping that it would just go away...If they mentioned Him, wouldn't that make Him a Martyr?...And would that not be what they were trying to avoid?...
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Old 03-08-2012, 07:59 AM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 21,941,988 times
Reputation: 2226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
Do you not see the same problem with this one as the TF...a Jew referring to someone as "Christ"??
He did not say He WAS the Christ, he simply stated that He was CALLED the Christ...
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Old 03-08-2012, 08:04 AM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 21,941,988 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneInDaMembrane View Post
Some guy walking around the Judean hillsides and Galilean seashore 2,000 years ago preaching a new refreshing spin on Judaism, claiming a new age was about to emerge after a period of judgment, picking up followers along the way while condemning the "establishment." Yeah, I can believe such a dude could have existed in the midst of all the religious nationalism and chaos of the day.

Some god who managed to implant himself in the womb of a virgin, predicted by sages of old, walked on water, raised people from the dead, multiplied bread and fish, using spit to give people sight, rising from the dead and then ascending to sit down on some throne out in space. I don't think so.
He didn't really bring anything NEW to the table...He didn't argue AGAINST what the Pharasee taught, He did argue against how they Lived it...All of what He said has it's origins in the Torah...So, again, nothing NEW was brought to the table...
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Old 03-08-2012, 08:47 AM
 
Location: Valencia, Spain
16,155 posts, read 12,821,127 times
Reputation: 2879
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alter2Ego View Post
Name and Occupation: Cornelius Tacitus, Roman Historian


Proof Tacitus Manuscript was Altered-Part 1 - YouTube

Proof Tacitus Manuscript was Altered-Part 2 - YouTube
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Old 03-08-2012, 09:49 AM
 
17,966 posts, read 15,924,575 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
I would be suspicious of the the passage that uses the word 'castle'...It sounds to European...Not Middle Eastern...From my research, it seems that the word, or even the very idea of a 'castle', from the Latin ''Castellum'', didn't come about until the 9th and 10th centuries, so how could it find it's use in a earlier document....
From: Castellum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
A castellum is a small Roman detached fort or fortlet used as a watch tower or signal station. The Latin word castellum is a diminutive of castra ("military camp"), which in turn is the plural of castrum ("watchpost"); it is the source of the English word "castle".
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Old 03-08-2012, 09:55 AM
 
17,966 posts, read 15,924,575 times
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We have historical documents from the first century concerning Jesus. They are called the four accounts, improperly called the four gospels.
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Old 03-08-2012, 09:59 AM
 
Location: Oxford, England
1,266 posts, read 1,240,395 times
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I have a number of concerns with the claims in these videos. I'll respond briefly to the most glaring ones. It seems to me the narrator is rather unfamiliar with this kind of scholarship, and the first clue is that he doesn't understand the script the scribe responsible for this manuscript was using. While the first word has been obviously changed from Chrestianos to Christianos, the second is indeed Christos, with the /i/. The descending stroke off the /r/ is the letter /i/. That's how it was often written in this time period. Just look at the first occurrence of Chrestianos. The /i/ following the /t/ is the same descending stroke from the crossing of the /t/. You can find the same ligature two lines above in the word "rumori," four lines below in the word "origine," and in the word "Tiberio" immediately following Christos. Here's a transcription of the context of the phrases in the manuscript, with the "ri" combinations attested with just the /r/ and a descending ligature in bold. Note no other occurrence of the letter /r/ has that descending ligature (they're underlined):

Quote:
Sed non ope humana, non largitionibus principis aut deum placamentis decedebat infamia, quin iussum incendium crederetur. ergo abolendo rumori Nero subdidit reos et quaesitissimis poenis adfecit quos per flagitia invisos vulgus Chrestianos appellabat. auctor nominis eius Christus Tiberio imperitante per procuratorem Pontium Pilatum supplicio adfectus erat; repressaque in praesens exitiabilis superstitio rursum erumpebat, non modo per Iudaeam, originem eius mali, sed per urbem etiam, quo cuncta undique atrocia aut pudenda confluunt celebranturque.
The narrator, however, completely ignores this combination everywhere else, instead insisting in the second video that the different shape of the letter indicates the letter was actually originally an /a/. This is just phenomenally naive. He can't even look over at the word "Tiberio" within the very frame of his video to find the corresponding /ri/ combination. The /a/ he highlights elsewhere on the manuscript is shaped like that because it is a capital A at the beginning of a word. In the middle of the word, the /a/ appears like the rounded fish symbol that you see dozens and dozens and dozens of times elsewhere in the manuscript. It also sits way too high within the word to have originally been an /a/, and the darkness of the ink is only the result of a short pause during the second stroke that overlapped the first. This guy simply and clearly doesn't know what he's talking about.

His comment about official Roman records not referring to Jesus as "the Good One" is also misguided. The "Good Ones" was a common appellative associated with Christians during the first couple centuries CE. It was a convenient nickname that Christians felt was applicable, and it had some currency within Judaism already. The Qumran literature, for instance, refers to the members of the Qumran community as the "Good Ones." The fact that the person responsible for the Tacitus manuscript used the common name of the group as well as the correct name of its leader shows awareness of these dynamics. A good recent article that touches on these issues can be previewed here.
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Old 03-08-2012, 10:19 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles, CA
70 posts, read 210,243 times
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ALTER2EGO -to- EVERYONE:

There is a second reference to Jesus in the works of Jewish historian Flavius Josephus. In Antiquities 20.200, he describes how, in AD 62, the high priest Ananus was deposed because he had illegally "convened the Sanhedrin [the highest Jewish religious court / governing body]. He had brought before them the brother of Jesus the so-called Christ, who was called James, and some other men, whom he accused of having broken the law, and handed them over to be stoned."

Notice the following points from this quotation from Josephus:

• Jesus had a brother called James
• James was executed by the Jewish leaders in AD 62
• There were claims that Jesus was the Messiah (that is, the Christ).

There is one other important point to notice from this quotation. Most scholars do not doubt the authenticity of this second reference to Jesus. Yet this passage refers to Jesus as the "so-called Christ". This brief comment appears to link back to Josephus' earlier reference to Jesus, and may even show that what he originally wrote there included some such comment as 'Jesus the so-called Christ.' Several of the books listed include some discussion of these passages from Josephus.
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Old 03-08-2012, 11:01 AM
 
Location: Valencia, Spain
16,155 posts, read 12,821,127 times
Reputation: 2879
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
We have historical documents from the first century concerning Jesus. They are called the four accounts, improperly called the four gospels.
Yeah....four conflicting accouns by unknown authors! Right on!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alter2Ego View Post
ALTER2EGO -to- EVERYONE:

There is a second reference to Jesus in the works of Jewish historian Flavius Josephus. In Antiquities 20.200, he describes how, in AD 62, the high priest Ananus was deposed because he had illegally "convened the Sanhedrin [the highest Jewish religious court / governing body]. He had brought before them the brother of Jesus the so-called Christ, who was called James, and some other men, whom he accused of having broken the law, and handed them over to be stoned."

Notice the following points from this quotation from Josephus:

• Jesus had a brother called James
• James was executed by the Jewish leaders in AD 62
• There were claims that Jesus was the Messiah (that is, the Christ).

There is one other important point to notice from this quotation. Most scholars do not doubt the authenticity of this second reference to Jesus. Yet this passage refers to Jesus as the "so-called Christ". This brief comment appears to link back to Josephus' earlier reference to Jesus, and may even show that what he originally wrote there included some such comment as 'Jesus the so-called Christ.' Several of the books listed include some discussion of these passages from Josephus.
We've already covered this. Do try to keep up to speed mate.

Had to bring this up from a now closed thread....

Quote:
Originally Posted by pneuma
Funny how reason leaves one speachless, could not takle my post, must be to much reason in it.
Eusebius replied....

Quote:
Learn how to use the word "to" and "too." It makes you look uneducated.

". . . must be too much reason."
Then from Eusebius....

Quote:
Did I ever say or infer that they bread a collie with a pit bull bull?
To which the only reply can be....

Learn how to use the word "bread" and "bred". It makes you look uneducated.

Ain't it a bugger how some things turn around and bite ya on the arse??
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Old 03-08-2012, 11:05 AM
 
17,966 posts, read 15,924,575 times
Reputation: 1010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
Yeah....four conflicting account by unknown authors! Right on!!
Actually the four accounts called the four gospels do not conflict with each other.
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