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I just read this verse in another thread and did not want to derail the thread. It seems in John 14:1 He is speaking of God as a separate entity from Himself. Notice he is speaking of a separate entity not of a "Manifestation of the Trinity" Such as Father.
John 14:1
21st Century King James Version (KJ21)
“Let not your heart be troubled. Ye believe in God; believe also in Me."
Common English Bible (CEB)
“Don’t be troubled. Trust in God. Trust also in me."
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“Don’t let yourselves be disturbed. Trust in God and trust in me.
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
"Let not your heart be troubled. You believe in God, believe also in me."
]New International Version (NIV)
“Do not let your hearts be troubled. You believe in God; believe also in me.
Last edited by june 7th; 11-16-2012 at 09:24 AM..
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If anything, this strengthens the idea that He is God. He is telling them to trust in Himself---just as they would God, The Father.
The question I'd ask at this point is, do you understand what the Trinity is? I'd be curious to see what your definition of it is.
When I was a Christian I would have answered "The Trinity is one God, in three Persons, one Being made up of three distinct Persons who exist in co-equal essence and co-eternal communion as the Father, Son and Holy Spirit." Which I sincerely believed for over 45 years.
Today my answer is it is a false doctrine based on Greek Mythology and is pseudo-polytheism.
When I was a Christian I would have answered "The Trinity is one God, in three Persons, one Being made up of three distinct Persons who exist in co-equal essence and co-eternal communion as the Father, Son and Holy Spirit." Which I sincerely believed for over 45 years.
Today my answer is it is a false doctrine based on Greek Mythology and is pseudo-polytheism.
Your definition of the Trinity (at least while you were acting as a Christian) is correct. That would mean that Jesus, The Son, could refer to himself separately from God, the Father. Both are God. To suggest that a person should trust in BOTH of them equally would be heresy if Jesus is not God.
Your definition of the Trinity (at least while you were acting as a Christian) is correct. That would mean that Jesus, The Son, could refer to himself separately from God, the Father. Both are God. To suggest that a person should trust in BOTH of them equally would be heresy if Jesus is not God.
When a Trinitarian speaks of God, he means The Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The sentence is illogical if Jesus(as) believed he was part of a Trinity.
If he had said:
"
“Let not your heart be troubled. Ye believe in The Father; believe also in Me."
He would have been indicating He also was God. Remember he was speaking to non-Trinitarian Jews that would not have related to the concept of God including Jesus(as). While if he said Father that would have related to a trinitarian concept.
When a Trinitarian speaks of God, he means The Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The sentence is illogical if Jesus(as) believed he was part of a Trinity.
If he had said:
"
“Let not your heart be troubled. Ye believe in The Father; believe also in Me."
He would have been indicating He also was God. Remember he was speaking to non-Trinitarian Jews that would not have related to the concept of God including Jesus(as). While if he said Father that would have related to a trinitarian concept.
He was referring to the Father---and told them to believe in Him----along with Himself. The Gospels didn't always use what we'd call "proper grammar". Earlier in John's Gospel he said he was the "I AM". The Jews he was speaking to knew what he meant and tried to stone him for it.
He was referring to the Father---and told them to believe in Him----along with Himself. The Gospels didn't always use what we'd call "proper grammar". Earlier in John's Gospel he said he was the "I AM". The Jews he was speaking to knew what he meant and tried to stone him for it.
I agree the Bible often does not use proper Grammar. But, it does not seem logical anyone would have used Theos if they meant Pater.
I agree the Bible often does not use proper Grammar. But, it does not seem logical anyone would have used Theos if they meant Pater.
If he wanted to demonstrate Jesus' divinity, he would. John's Gospel is written with all sorts of references like that. It's what he was trying to do.
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