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Were you ostracized from your family for leaving it? Did the Church forbid any independent investigation into Scripture - like reading it for yourself? Did they forbid you from speaking to non-Christians?
I know people who fear rejection from their family if they were to leave the faith. In my case it was the lesser problem of not wanting to cause concern or break me sainted mother's heart. Social pressure exists in mainstream churches, in varying degrees. Dependency exists, in varying degrees. It's worse in cults, and what makes a cult in my mind is less what they do than it is a matter of degree.
Forbidding others, especially one's children, to consort with non-Christians is fairly common among evangelicals, who have church-sponsored private schools and home schooling to create intellectual and spiritual ghettoes. Diversity is not their friend, for the most part. There are exceptions of course.
I don't think most fringe groups mind people reading the Bible or memorizing it, what they control is the interpretation and the doctrine cherry-picked from it. There is not really much of a distinction between cults and mainstream religion in this regard, other than cults are more strident and overtly controlling and lack the subtlety of the established churches.
I know people who fear rejection from their family if they were to leave the faith. In my case it was the lesser problem of not wanting to cause concern or break me sainted mother's heart. Social pressure exists in mainstream churches, in varying degrees. Dependency exists, in varying degrees. It's worse in cults, and what makes a cult in my mind is less what they do than it is a matter of degree.
Forbidding others, especially one's children, to consort with non-Christians is fairly common among evangelicals, who have church-sponsored private schools and home schooling to create intellectual and spiritual ghettoes. Diversity is not their friend, for the most part. There are exceptions of course.
I don't think most fringe groups mind people reading the Bible or memorizing it, what they control is the interpretation and the doctrine cherry-picked from it. There is not really much of a distinction between cults and mainstream religion in this regard, other than cults are more strident and overtly controlling and lack the subtlety of the established churches.
I think what you are dealing with as well as many of the people here who are saying mainstream Christianity is a cult is more of a generational worldview difference and not the same as coming out of a real cult. People born after 1983 are usually atheist or agnostic and have little tolerance for religion of any kind. They have a very cut and dry view of religion where the most benign church is just as evil as the Westboro Baptist Church it's just packaged in a more acceptable way. You are either with the good guys (atheists/agnostics) or are pure evil (any religion). That is quite a different duality than what genuine cult survivors have to deal with. There are some similarities, but also many differences.
yes a few things to share.
myths
every witch is a white witch .
we only believe and practice white magic
we love christians and honor jesus
cults never use-- group auto suggestion to make converts see and hear things that did not happen
cults never use--- sex food and sleep deprivation and drugs to control converts
cults never use-- group auto suggestion to make converts see and hear things that did not happen
cults never use--- sex food and sleep deprivation and drugs to control converts
These are the two things true cults usually use.
Sleep deprivation and hallucinogenic drugs to simulate a false spiritual experience are quite common.
4O years ago the Scientology guys set up their first operation in Toronto...It was an old funeral parlor. My girlfriend and I were curious so we went in - In no time at all they had taken money from us and had us semi hypnotized ....It was a crude operation by todays standards...The first thing they send us out to do was go find someone to co-sign for a bank loan and give them the money...well...I did not like that -so that did not take place...I had noticed that during some of their "session" woman would come out of the room in tears saying they were being touched inappropriately...I did not like that either- finally I asked for my money back- They refused.
Later they found out that my girl friend was from a wealthy family so they attempt to jettison me to get their hands on her...and I did not like that either... No- this early version of the cult in Toronto were nasty...They kept their victims half starved - sleep deprived and in a semi trance through a system of alternating the left and right parts of the body and brain...They were a shrewd bunch. Cults abound...they are everywhere...These guys back then were attempting to be respectable- eventually they incorporated the Christian cross...but had nothing to do with Christianity what so ever- It was a money cult.
Has anybody on this board ever been involved in a cult? If so, what type of cult was it and what were the main tenants and beliefs i.e. how was it different from mainstream religion? What made you susceptible, how did they draw you in, what caused you to question it, and ultimately how did you get out?
I used to live in a men's home. I know men's homes can be notorious for harsh conditions, but there was a lot more to it than that. Director's of the homes are supposed to help out with most of the activity in the home, but this director was only seen for about an hour a week. Other than that he just chilled, and even at church he'd be on his phone the whole time, or off somewhere else talking to someone.
He had two other former members of the home doing his job for him. One of them was exploited, he had nowhere to go, and the other was about as corrupt as you could imagine (Neither one was paid). All he did was try to make people leave, he'd lie, cheat, steal...tell people their wife looked like a man. There was no low this guy wouldn't stoop to. The reason I left the home is because that same guy told me I had to go to a job 10 minutes after my only visit of the week. My 8 year old daughter had to leave, and it was all b.s. There was no job to go to, he only did it to get under my skin, and I ended up finding a place to live because of the conditions there.
We often weren't fed lunch, or given water, even if we worked all day. We were told that we didn't usually have enough money to eat like we wanted. Yet when I was the home's cook the director and I would go grocery shopping. The first time we went he was grocery shopping for his house as well. When it was time to pay this guy busted out 4 or 5 ebt cards,(food stamps that belonged to people in the home) and one by one slid them through until we had paid for his food with our stamps. There were nights where we weren't even able to go to bed, 29 hours was the longest we went without sleep. If we ever disagreed with anything, we were told that we were going against what God wanted for us. So then whatever they said to us, was actually from God?? Did God want us to be worked like slaves, become sleep deprived and malnourished?
Even after the director found out all the things that were going on in the home, he refused to kick anyone out. One of the director's classic lines was "God will provide". Yet when confronted with what his "guy" was doing his response was "but I need him to work for us". Hypocrite!!! This guy was indispensable, and he knew it(and took full advantage) That was how the home made money. The director had a website offering dirt cheap labor that we would provide, while he pocketed the cash.
After I left the home I was pretty much an outcast. They kept warning me not to leave, and I pissed them off when I did. I guess the senior pastor looked at it like less income for him. I mean they had a pastor that only spoke about giving your finances to the church, that's all he did, sometimes more than once per service!!! Nothing was free, everything was about giving the church money. They would always brag about how wonderful they were for having a men's home, that helped people, while the senior pastor pocketed 10% of the income the home made. They were always asking for $1000 or $2000 pledges, and of course they would announce who gave what.
I went to one of their men's conferences in L.A. county that lasted five days. Every single speech was about giving the church money, or about going out and building new churches. (90% of the men at the conference were living in one of their homes) Had nothing to do with our lives, or our family, just anything that would help line their pockets. They had all kinds of merchandise for sale...These people are good at what they do, and they have churches all over the country. Be on the lookout for a church that claims they go to the inner cities to reach the drug addicts and prostitutes!!!
Last edited by Maxwell82; 07-22-2013 at 10:35 PM..
Do you really feel that the major religion Christianity is a cult, however?
Yes, that is why I said so.
Quote:
Were you ostracized from your family for leaving it? Did the Church forbid any independent investigation into Scripture - like reading it for yourself? Did they forbid you from speaking to non-Christians?
No, I was fortunate to have been raised in the Methodist tradition, as opposed to Catholicism or Baptism, and my folks didn't throw me out. They weren't happy, but they also aren't crazy, so they didn't ostracize me. I was confirmed in the Methodist church, and I studied the scripture for many years. That's a big part of why I no longer profess to be Christian. The bible makes no sense.
Quote:
I don't agree that Christianity is a cult - if one looks at the proper definitions of what makes a cult a cult. Just because it has some rather strange rituals and beliefs, does not make it a cult.
I'd like you to consider this. Lets say you'd had no exposure to religion until you were an adult, and then you're presented with any of the major religions. Whether it's a Catholic priest going on in latin about eating the body and drinking the blood of your savior, listening to prayers in Arabic as you bow towards Mecca five times a day on a special rug, or cutting off part of an infant's penis as part of a religious ideal. What about these things, as a thinking adult, doesn't seem extremely disturbing, or at least ridiculously absurd?
I think the whole concept of cults as being strange or absurd is completely self-serving to the mainstream religious. The only thing your mainstream religion has over any so-called "cult" is that they're older. They're older, and they've indoctrinated many generations of people from birth, until the point where much of the absurdity is lost in tradition.
The only difference between a religion and a cult is that the cult pays taxes.
I used to live in a men's home. I know men's homes can be notorious for harsh conditions, but there was a lot more to it than that. Director's of the homes are supposed to help out with most of the activity in the home, but this director was only seen for about an hour a week. Other than that he just chilled, and even at church he'd be on his phone the whole time, or off somewhere else talking to someone.
He had two other former members of the home doing his job for him. One of them was exploited, he had nowhere to go, and the other was about as corrupt as you could imagine (Neither one was paid). All he did was try to make people leave, he'd lie, cheat, steal...tell people their wife looked like a man. There was no low this guy wouldn't stoop to. The reason I left the home is because that same guy told me I had to go to a job 10 minutes after my only visit of the week. My 8 year old daughter had to leave, and it was all b.s. There was no job to go to, he only did it to get under my skin, and I ended up finding a place to live because of the conditions there.
We often weren't fed lunch, or given water, even if we worked all day. We were told that we didn't usually have enough money to eat like we wanted. Yet when I was the home's cook the director and I would go grocery shopping. The first time we went he was grocery shopping for his house as well. When it was time to pay this guy busted out 4 or 5 ebt cards,(food stamps that belonged to people in the home) and one by one slid them through until we had paid for his food with our stamps. There were nights where we weren't even able to go to bed, 29 hours was the longest we went without sleep. If we ever disagreed with anything, we were told that we were going against what God wanted for us. So then whatever they said to us, was actually from God?? Did God want us to be worked like slaves, become sleep deprived and malnourished?
Even after the director found out all the things that were going on in the home, he refused to kick anyone out. One of the director's classic lines was "God will provide". Yet when confronted with what his "guy" was doing his response was "but I need him to work for us". Hypocrite!!! This guy was indispensable, and he knew it(and took full advantage) That was how the home made money. The director had a website offering dirt cheap labor that we would provide, while he pocketed the cash.
After I left the home I was pretty much an outcast. They kept warning me not to leave, and I pissed them off when I did. I guess the senior pastor looked at it like less income for him. I mean they had a pastor that only spoke about giving your finances to the church, that's all he did, sometimes more than once per service!!! Nothing was free, everything was about giving the church money. They would always brag about how wonderful they were for having a men's home, that helped people, while the senior pastor pocketed 10% of the income the home made. They were always asking for $1000 or $2000 pledges, and of course they would announce who gave what.
I went to one of their men's conferences in L.A. county that lasted five days. Every single speech was about giving the church money, or about going out and building new churches. (90% of the men at the conference were living in one of their homes) Had nothing to do with our lives, or our family, just anything that would help line their pockets. They had all kinds of merchandise for sale...These people are good at what they do, and they have churches all over the country. Be on the lookout for a church that claims they go to the inner cities to reach the drug addicts and prostitutes!!!
Sorry you had to go through all that. That reminds me of a post I saw on this board one time where a young college-aged guy was questioning his faith and decided to write a popular Christian minister/author. That minister did write him back...asking for money. Those people are not following true Christian teachings at all and are simply in it for the money. Unfortunately there is a lot of that in our world today. Religion is easy money for people who know how to play the game and can manipulate their followers into giving. Some cults are elaborate scams for money. Others are started by people who really believe some strange stuff. Most of them could care less about money.
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