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Old 10-07-2013, 09:27 PM
 
58,540 posts, read 34,503,201 times
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Time out. Let's re-read the title of the thread. Teaching Creation is NOT the same as teaching YEC Creationism or the Discovery Institutes surrogate Intelligent Design. Those are clearly fraudulent attempts to inject religion into science curricula. They have been exposed . . . making them convenient targets for those here who want easy targets. The original OP title at least used the term Creation . . . and that is a very different question entirely. It is NOT incompatible with evolution in any way. It answers a question science cannot currently answer . . . so there can be no conflict with science.
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Old 10-07-2013, 09:45 PM
 
Location: South Africa
5,563 posts, read 6,896,371 times
Reputation: 1795
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Time out. Let's re-read the title of the thread. Teaching Creation is NOT the same as teaching YEC Creationism or the Discovery Institutes surrogate Intelligent Design. Those are clearly fraudulent attempts to inject religion into science curricula. They have been exposed . . . making them convenient targets for those here who want easy targets. The original OP title at least used the term Creation . . . and that is a very different question entirely. It is NOT incompatible with evolution in any way. It answers a question science cannot currently answer . . . so there can be no conflict with science.
So do enlighten us as to what "creationism" teaches that science cannot?
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Old 10-07-2013, 09:55 PM
 
58,540 posts, read 34,503,201 times
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Originally Posted by SeekerSA View Post
So do enlighten us as to what "creationism" teaches that science cannot?
Creation, Seeker . . . NOT creationism. Science can teach many of the How's about the function of our reality . . . but it cannot teach What our reality IS and Why it is; What life IS and Why it is; What consciousness IS and Why it is; and What intelligence IS and Why it is.
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Old 10-07-2013, 10:02 PM
 
Location: South Africa
5,563 posts, read 6,896,371 times
Reputation: 1795
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Creation, Seeker . . . NOT creationism. Science can teach many of the How's about the function of our reality . . . but it cannot teach What our reality IS and Why it is; What life IS and Why it is; What consciousness IS and Why it is; and What intelligence IS and Why it is.
OK, stop with the semantics and enlighten us.
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Old 10-07-2013, 10:36 PM
 
Location: The backwoods of Pennsylvania ... unfortunately.
6,119 posts, read 3,956,278 times
Reputation: 4172
Quote:
Number two, you open up the doors for Christians to be forced fed other beliefs.
LOL! There was some high school somewhere in the southern United States that fought tooth and nail to allow religious literature (i.e. pamphlets and Chic crap) to be distributed on school property during school hours. It even went to the local courts where a judge finally ruled that students handing out religious literature to other students was not in violation of the Constitution (students are not government employees, after all).

The Christians thought this was a great victory for their efforts of increasing the level of religious fascism in the United States.

But wait ... what's going on over there?!

Oh no, there's a group of pagans over there handing out their literature and pamphlets!! How dare they do such a thing! The ruling was supposed to allow only Christian literature to be handed out, not pagans or any other religion.

Wow, did that little stunt about handing out religious literature completely backfire on the Christians. I couldn't stop laughing when I heard about it.
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Old 10-07-2013, 10:39 PM
 
Location: The backwoods of Pennsylvania ... unfortunately.
6,119 posts, read 3,956,278 times
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I should make a slight correction, Atheism and Modern Christianity are tied for the world's most intolerant religion and never tolerate me expressing my thoughts.
I would still like to hear about how atheism is tied with "modern Christianity" for the most intolerant "religion" in the world. I would so enjoy hearing all about what you can't do because of atheism.
Moderator cut: delete

Moderator cut: delete

Last edited by Miss Blue; 10-08-2013 at 07:18 AM.. Reason: discussing mod action...
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Old 10-07-2013, 11:41 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
33,123 posts, read 35,266,975 times
Reputation: 13582
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Time out. Let's re-read the title of the thread. Teaching Creation is NOT the same as teaching YEC Creationism or the Discovery Institutes surrogate Intelligent Design. Those are clearly fraudulent attempts to inject religion into science curricula. They have been exposed . . . making them convenient targets for those here who want easy targets. The original OP title at least used the term Creation . . . and that is a very different question entirely. It is NOT incompatible with evolution in any way. It answers a question science cannot currently answer . . . so there can be no conflict with science.
Never the less, creation is NOT science and should not be taught as such. There are many many questions science cannot answer yet, and it is ridiculous to plug god into those unanswered questions.
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Old 10-08-2013, 12:56 AM
 
7,801 posts, read 5,972,282 times
Reputation: 2981
Quote:
Originally Posted by bulmabriefs144 View Post
Uhhhhh, yea. That's literally how stupid the argument against creation is.
Maybe the arguments YOU have constructed against it. However they seem to be misrepresentations of the ACTUAL argument I have seen throughout the thread.

Creationism is not about what was created. It is a claim about WHO did that creating. It is the claim that the creation was done by an intellgient, willful, thinking, conscious agent.

And to date, especially by the posters on THIS thread, that is an entirely unsubstantiated proposition.
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Old 10-08-2013, 12:58 AM
 
7,801 posts, read 5,972,282 times
Reputation: 2981
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Originally Posted by fschmidt View Post
I should make a slight correction, Atheism and Modern Christianity are tied for the world's most intolerant religion and never tolerate me expressing my thoughts.
Still just making things up I see after all these pages?

Tell me exactly what in the sentence "There is no reason to think that the universe was created by a willful, conscious, intelligent agent" stops you from "expressing your thoughts".

No one is stopping you expressing your thoughts. You just have a persecution complex. What we are doing is DISAGREEING with your thoughts. If you want to misconstrue the latter as the former in order to make it look like you are being persecuted and held down then so be it. But no one is falling for this except possibly you yourself.
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Old 10-08-2013, 05:00 AM
 
3,402 posts, read 2,590,492 times
Reputation: 1322
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Creation, Seeker . . . NOT creationism. Science can teach many of the How's about the function of our reality . . . but it cannot teach What our reality IS and Why it is; What life IS and Why it is; What consciousness IS and Why it is; and What intelligence IS and Why it is.
And those questions are best explored in philosophy and religion classes, which of course is where they already are taught. Trying to determine the philosphpical basis of reality is, as you say, not part of science and should not be taught as such. In this I don't think we disagree at all.

NoCapo
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