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I'd never thought I'd agree with Shirina, but here we have it. I don't get how serving someone gay is supporting them.
I haven't read all the posts her, so forgive me if I repeat something. Remember the Chic Fil A comments? The president criticized the Supreme Courts ruling on gay marriage. It set off a firestorm, but he never said they weren't welcome at the restaurants.
Again, if you're a Christian and going strictly by biblical principles, then sin is sin and you really shouldn't serve anyone. The bible doesn't say homosexuality is a sin REALLY to be condemned, but other sins will get a wink and a nod. To do so IS taking biblical law halfway.
I'm not a business owner, but if I were, everyone would be welcome. That's just good business.
According to Biblical teaching, they're supposed to KILL homosexuals, so they're already violating the Bible by letting a gay couple walk away alive.
They can't take a Biblical law halfway and then pretend that God would be happy.
So my thinking is to just dispense with the BS about "Biblical teaching" and just run a business. It sure would make the world a more peaceful place. Then we wouldn't even have to argue about whether discrimination is such a peachy keen thing for our society. We would have come to understand that it is NOT a long time ago if not for people dredging up verses from the Bible to use as an excuse for bigotry and hatred.
You make a VERY good point here Shirina.
It made me look at the issue from this perspective.
Wanna go by the Bible...and not violate your religious doctrine? COOL! Then they we will legislate THIS, since it is the crux of the doctrine:
#1. Love each other.
#2. Treat others the way you would want them to treat you.
#3. Any confusion about #2, refer to #1.
Serving food at a restaurant is one thing. A restaurant owner who is opposed to homosexuality should be willing to serve food to gay people.
A baker should be willing to make a cake for a gay wedding.
A photographer who is opposed to homosexuality should not have to take pictures at a gay wedding. The photographer would have to be at the wedding for several hours and would have to endure seeing things he finds distasteful.
If you were a professional photographer, would you be willing to take pictures at a KKK rally? A Neo-Nazi rally?
You're really not understanding this. Homosexuals, atheists, Jews and Muslims already serve Christians who don't agree with them, or like them, on a daily basis.
Our society in America relies on this civility. Liberty and justice for all relies on this. We stand for the freedom to live and let live regardless of our personal beliefs. We will collapse without it. It wouldn't matter who we let discriminate. Let's not beat around the bush here, if the majority of Christians want a Christian Nation, then it's all or nothing. You can't tip toe up to it. I don't think the majority of Christians want this, only a select few. If they do I'd like to know so I can catch a plane out of here to England or Japan, asap. lol
Last edited by PoppySead; 02-26-2014 at 08:32 AM..
You make a VERY good point here Shirina.
It made me look at the issue from this perspective.
Wanna go by the Bible...and not violate your religious doctrine? COOL! Then they we will legislate THIS, since it is the crux of the doctrine:
#1. Love each other.
#2. Treat others the way you would want them to treat you.
#3. Any confusion about #2, refer to #1.
Good points! If your going with this then let's go all the way.
This just won't work because after all is said and done we have to remember that these are personally held beliefs. That's all. Personal. And if we are allowed as a society to function purely on our own personally held beliefs we will no longer be able to function as a nation. We will have to separate by those beliefs so that we can survive. We will no longer be able to be united under a constitution, it won't mean anything.
Good points! If your going with this then let's go all the way.
This just won't work because after all is said and done we have to remember that these are personally held beliefs. That's all. Personal. And if we are allowed as a society to function purely on our own personally held beliefs we will no longer be able to function as a nation. We will have to separate by those beliefs so that we can survive. We will no longer be able to be united under a constitution, it won't mean anything.
Yes...that is the root of the problem Poppy. Everyone functions off of their personal headtrips...no matter what the basis for them.
I've been in business for most of my life...I never had a problem being cool to everyone. After all...I was certainly in no position to be passing judgement on anyone with the glass house I was working in. They see me as every evil all wrapped up in one!!
I saw the opposite end of it...people hating on me and wanting to get rid of me and my business because of their personal feelings/beliefs/opinions. In many jurisdictions they get the local/state government to pass very restrictive ordinances and regulations...some so restrictive it is effectively a ban.
Yet again, judging by your thoughts about what this bill says, I don't believe that you have actually read the bill.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amaznjohn
I've read it plenty of times. How is "exercise of religion" not an action? Serving a homosexual an egg and some bacon does not prevent the exercise of religion, unless the cook is a Jew.
Here's a summary of the bill from Arizona Central:
According to Biblical teaching, they're supposed to KILL homosexuals, so they're already violating the Bible by letting a gay couple walk away alive.
They can't take a Biblical law halfway and then pretend that God would be happy.
So my thinking is to just dispense with the BS about "Biblical teaching" and just run a business. It sure would make the world a more peaceful place. Then we wouldn't even have to argue about whether discrimination is such a peachy keen thing for our society. We would have come to understand that it is NOT a long time ago if not for people dredging up verses from the Bible to use as an excuse for bigotry and hatred.
As you know the argument about killing homosexuals is that it was simply a law for the ancient Hebrews and doesn't pertain to modern Christians.
I agree with you about dispensing of the biblical teaching concept, but to many Christians the Bible IS their life, which includes their business. I'm not sure who is claiming that discrimination is good for society. Bigotry and hatred can be justified in many ways, including the Bible.
Really? Where in the bible does it say not to sell cakes to gays? I missed that verse.
Selling a cake for ANY wedding is just that, selling a cake. If your religious belefs prevents you from selling cakes do not open a bakery.
Where in the bible does it say that you have to prevent others "sins"? As far as I can remember it says love your neighbor, do unto others as you would have done unto you, and don't judge. Nothing about don't rent rooms or sell cakes to gays.
Good points! If your going with this then let's go all the way.
This just won't work because after all is said and done we have to remember that these are personally held beliefs. That's all. Personal. And if we are allowed as a society to function purely on our own personally held beliefs we will no longer be able to function as a nation. We will have to separate by those beliefs so that we can survive. We will no longer be able to be united under a constitution, it won't mean anything.
That's an excellent "kumbaya" post, with which I believe nearly everyone would agree, but we can't legislate it. This Bill was passed to prevent issues such as the wealthy gay couple suing the cake baker for not providing their cake for religious reasons. Message to the happy couple: Get another baker and don't fill the court dockets with such silly lawsuits.
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