Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 11,435,824 times
Reputation: 1463
Advertisements
Have you noticed that all religions have something very beautiful to express dinivity? Christianism, specially Roman Catholic has Angels and Arcangels for example, the hindu equivalent of them are the Devas and Mahadevas.
Mahadevas, such as Lord Ganesha, have such tremenduous tasks under their diligence that they are sometimes called themselves gods under the Supreme One God. The Trimurti is composed of Brahmā, Vishnu and Shiva. (Note: Mahadeva generally refers to Shiva) The devas are functionally equivalent of angels who serve God in Judaeo-Christian tradition, There are also many other lesser celestial beings in Hinduism such as Gandharvas or celestial musicians.
Don't you find that concept of Trimurti another reference to Trinity? Brahma is the creator in spirit, Vishnu the Preserver and Shiva the Destroyer
Aren't Devas and Mahadevas something beautiful and divine? just as much as Angels and Archangels?
It is also interesting that Music is considered something from heaven as well huh? or what do you think?
Finally to close the post, some people believe that Devas are Gods and that hinduism is polytheistic, but actually Hindus know that there is only one God, the Sat-Tat-Om which concept was explained in a previous post, http://www.city-data.com/forum/relig...at-tat-om.html
Devas are just manifestations of Spirit, concept and ideas such as compassion, wisdom, purity, etc.
I don't think any hindu believer 'believes' that there is only one god
I think many believe that there is the one God, but he can manifest himself in whatever way he wants, or needs. For anyone to say there is no other deity other than Jesus, imprisons God to that one form. God can come to a person in the form of Jesus to get them to listen, but I believe if you let God be who he wishes, he would come in different forms to better express himself, than to be stuck with the face of Jesus. Plus, I think Jesus is not a representation of God. I think the Rider from Rev19 is a more closer depiction of God than anything else in the Bible.
Wow, the notion that just one being has singularity of all goodness power and knowledge is just a somewhat isolated and sterile idea. Therefore, we detect other beings. Polytheism, which is what angels or Deva's are, makes so much more sense than the singularity of superGOD.
I don't think any hindu believer 'believes' that there is only one god
They do believe that there is only one "Ultimate Creator" and that the Angels "messengers" are worthy of prayer and praise, which explains why that Ultimate God created them.
The word "god" is so vague and multidimensional. The Angels are immortal, the Divas are immortal, etc.
How nice to have a thread on a Hindu subject. I suppose that, in terms of religion, what I like is a sort of Hindu -Buddhism with a lot of Ramayana in it. (not the bespoke Gods and demi -gods of Mahayana, please) so one may have have all the fun and colour of Hinduism and its gods and goddesses without actually needing to worship any of them.
It's rather like a liking for Catholicism but being protestant so as not to have to do what the Pope says.
And, yes, I believe that Hindu thought has developed (why shouldn't it?) from a tribe of Olympians to various manifestations of a single cosmic 'Brahma' (though I believe Krishna and even the Mahayana Adi -Buddha take on the same role (indeed a cosmic god is the god of all religions -or none).
Oi vey. All this talk about whether Hindus believe in many gods only, or in One Supreme God with many other minor gods, or whether or not Hinduism claims all the 330,000,000 Hndu gods are manifestations of one God. The snarky answer to these questions (only one God, is it simply polytheism with no supreme God, or is it both one Supreme God manifested as many millions minor Gods?) is Yes. The truth is that Hinduism could be said to be a religious tradition that is characterized by being a "religion" which espouses all of these contradictory views.
Well, remember Hinduism does not have a creed or a historic founder. Despite not havi these two elements, Hindu culture is suprisingly unified, but not in the same way as Confucianism, Zoarastrianism or Christianity which are based on the teachings of single person. Hindusim is a religious culture, rather than the product of a single mind as we are more used to in the West. (I believe we are in a post Christian Culture today in the West. However, we are still influenced by the notions of religion which have exited in the West since the Roman Empire embraced Christianity. Even when Westerners reject religion, they still assume religions are in essence the type of thing that Christianity is, more or less. This is one of the main reasons Westerners keep trying to approach Hinduism as if it had a unified set of beliefs like Christianity does.)
Consequently, it seems the hardest thing for westerners to understand about Hinduism is that it includes a great variety of beliefs and even many, many contradicitory ideas. Followers of the classsical Sankhya philosophy are best understood as atheists with respect to a Cosmic Creator, and yet these atheistic philosophers are part of the Hindui tradition and recognized as orthodox by Hindus who may themselves be very devout believers in a Creator God. Further, more likely then not, these theists will espouse the position that there is only One Supreme God while worphiping many lesser gods in his/her daily rituals. To further complicate matters, Sankhya philosophy is inon-theistic with respect to the polytheistc gods of hinduism Sankhya teaches a vehicle of salvation with no mention whatsoever of the 330 million polytheistic gods that we often speak of when speaking of Hinduism. On the other hand, there is a classical school of Hinduism which does not believe in a Supreme Creator God at all, but is entirely dedicated to the ritual worhsip of the ancient Vedic polytheistic gods discussed in the earliest Hindu texts such as the Rg Veda.
The truth is some HIndus believe in a Monotheistic God while believing in the eistence of many minor and separate gods, while other Hindus believe that the many gods are manifestation of One God. Another twist which will likely surprise Westerners is that the dominant philosophical school of modern Hinduism (Advaita Vedanta) will declare that ultimately the Creator God Himself is an illusion. This school uses an argument from design to prove the necessity of an intelligent creator when arguing with the atheistic Sankhya which claims the universe is caused by the contact of prakirti (matter) with individual souls (purushas) without any Creator God at all. Vedanta, in contrasts, argues for a Creator God who creates all the universe as an all-knowing and all powerful Creator God, but then turns around and says that this is only true to the extent that the universe is ultimately real, and the universe is actually not finally really existent.
Advaita Vedanta teaches that the universe is ultimately an unreal appearance as is its Creator. Salvation occurs in this system where we realize that all that exists is a principle refered to as Brahman which is declared to be one without a second. Nothing exists but Brahman Brahman might be thought of in Western terms as a substance with no qualities. More recently, a professor I saw on the Net who adopted a Western theological idea for Brahman by saying we could think of Brahman as something like is the Act of Being Itself. I believe this is how St Thomas Aquinus described the Christian God when considered philosophically. However, St. Thomas was Christian and believed that the At of Being Itself was a personal Trinitarian God and Advaita Vedanta explicitly states that Brahman is impersonal and therefore this version of Hidnusim espouses a non-thiestic monism as the final truth.
Over the last thirty years or since I have began to study Hinduism as a non-Hindu Westerner, I realized that all that I learned second hand in classes had to be balanced by talking with actual Hindus whenever possible and reading original texts. From talking to actual Hindus, I discovered that many ideas Western Scholars and teachers seem to think are held by Hinduism as a whole are not opinions shared by many Hindus.
For example, most attempts to teach Hinduism at the University level will claim that Hindusim proclaims that the great Hindu gods Brahma, Shiva, and Vishnu are manifestations of One God. That was "news" to a Hindu I spoke to who had grown up in India ( I met him in Salem, MA). He belived that Brahma, Shiva, and Vishnu were just three different gods plain and simple. On the other hand, many Hindu texts (considered orthodox by Hinduism as a whole) will speak about the Trimurti (Vishnu, Brahma, Shiva) as three different manifestations of One Divine Principle (I am thinking now of some of Shakara's writings). This is similiar to how it is usually depicted in the university. However, it is not exactly the same since Shankara is talking about Brahman which is not God, but a monistic Divine principle with not personal attributes. Similiarly, I just became aware of South Indian medievial religious poem which spoke of the Trimutri as being the manifestation of one Supreme God. (In this case, the poet held Vishnu as the Supreme God. Vishnu here was considered by the poet to be both the Absolute Reaity and a personal God, much like we are used to in the West). This last view is the closest to what is usually taught in the West as what Hindus believed. It is not that the Western Scholars are always wrong, it is just that too oftern than not their presentations make Hindus seemed more unified in belief than than they actually are.
I met another Hindu who grew up in India and is today a doctor here in upstate New York. This fellow was familiar with the idea that ultimately all gods are one God, but he said despite that the emphasis is on the multiplicity of gods. In his case, I think you could say his tradition was very similar to that proclaimed by most Western interpreters of Hinduism. However, as this is by no means the only understanding embraced by Hindu culture. The examples given above demonstrate this.
If you are confused, that could be a good thing because at least you are begining to appreciate the tremendous diversity of thought embrace by Hindu religous culture and you now realize Hinduism cannot be reduced to a simple creed, or even a single complex creed. Nonetheism, Pure Polytheism, Monotheism, Provisional Monotheism with Monism as Ultimate Truth, a blend of Polytheim with Monotheism can all be embraced by a Hindu.
What makes one a Hindu? That is a big question. Some traits that would seem to apply is belief in the authority of the Vedas (Hinduism's most ancient texts), believe in karma and reincarnation, believe in an absolute/indivisible soul as the basis of our individual awareness (a single Atman/brahman in case of Vendanta, a multiplicity of purushas in the case of classical Sankhya/Yoga schools as well as the more Mono-Theistic schools of thought), and a respect for the multiplicity of traditional polytheistic gods of India. Even the elite philosphical Avaita Vedanta school has a subschool which advocates picking a person favoite of these gods (the recommend one of the top 5 gods)to worship as a form of purification. This tradition is called Smarta and it is claimed to be founded by Shankara himself, the most respected Avaita Vedantan phlosopher.
Still even these traits are not exhuastive, and I bet you could find a devout Hindu who considered himelf orthodox who shared none of this traits. The good news about having an interest in Hindusim is that you will never run out of things to learn.
To see a different side of Hinduism than all that I discussed here, look up the TV versions of the Mahabarata and the Ramayana with English subtitles. What I wrote above may help you pick up a few things here or there, but when you watch these adaptations of the revered epic poems of India, you will see that Hinduism is actually a religion very much concerned with worldly affairs despite it also having devoted a lot of thought to escaping this world through various forms of yoga (which includes bhakti yoga, or devotion to a Monotheistic type of Supreme God).
Last edited by Frank Talk; 06-15-2016 at 05:02 PM..
Reason: self-proofreading
Oi vey. All this talk about whether Hindus believe in many gods only, or in One Supreme God with many other minor gods, or whether or not Hinduism claims all the 330,000,000 Hndu gods are manifestations of one God. The snarky answer to these questions (only one God, is it simply polytheism with no supreme God, or is it both one Supreme God manifested as many millions minor Gods?) is Yes. The truth is that Hinduism could be said to be a religious tradition that is characterized by being a "religion" which espouses all of these contradictory views.
Frank, let me commend you for the Best First Post Ever. Like most first posters you see 100% of the threads as new, pick one that interests you, and manage to resurrect a zombie thread that is 9 years old. But that's where the similarity ends. I learned something today from you. Welcome, and I hope you post more!
This concept is representation of a much deeper knowledge though.
As a unit of nature develops to the point that it crosses into the intelligent side and becomes Self conscious, it becomes a unit of intelligent side.
That unit is immortal and perfect, in immortal and perfect body.
It has three minds. Mind of Knower, mind of Thinker and mind of Doer. Those are not separate "brains" so to speak, but are aspects of the same mind, each one part of same yet, each one different in its functions and relationship to the Light of Intelligence. With Doer mind being one in the physical and for communication/operation with and in the physical. Knower aspect is in the Light. Thinker is approximately a mediator between the Knower mind and the Doer mind and is that Self's rightness and reason.
As such, Self is called Triune Self. With Doer being equivalent of the Son, Knower the Father and Thinker the Holy Spirit.
Also, there is a primordial trinity. It is is Consciousness/Substance/Space.
Everything, manifested or not, is in Space. Modern science knows nothing of that Space. It is not considered or studied by science. Space is universal container of everything and anything.
Consciousness gives design, development, and order to everything. Everything, manifested or not, functions as it is, due to measure of consciousness in it. On the nature side, everything functions and is conscious as its function only. On the intelligent side, everything is conscious that it is conscious.
Everything is in space, is determined by Consciousness and originates from Substance. Substance is inert amorphous "dough" that gives birth to anything per Consciousness. As an idea of design appears in Consciousness, Substance is acted upon and a new unit comes to existence, starting its path on the Eternal Order of Progression, through the nature side then through the intelligent side, until it becomes Consciousness.
This is the Great Trinity of all the worlds, known and unknown, manifested and not.
Those concepts find their presentations in various ideas of tri-gods through human history.
I don't think any hindu believer 'believes' that there is only one god
How many gods were there while Jesus walked on Earth? If you say "one" Trinity, then a Hindu would also say that there is only "one" Trimurti. If an angel (messenger god) is not part of and parcel with the One God, then wouldn't it logically be against It? So monotheists are simply another type of polytheist (believe in many deities) who believe that only the highest "divinity" can be worshiped -- because they believe that It happens to be jealous enough to need itself singularly thanked and invoked, and hateful enough to become angry and mad to the point of having to do some sadistic "something" about it if otherwise. Monotheism thus espouses countless contradictory views even against it's own general concept.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
