Another nail in the coffin of religion (prophets, exist, miracles)
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Well that's an easy escape route. Just dismiss any source or website that is not 100% atheist. Atheists limit the parameters for evidence to such a narrow margin that it would be impossible to prove that anything in life exists. I suspect this is done out of fear.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
Well that's an easy escape route. Just dismiss any source or website that is not 100% atheist. Atheists limit the parameters for evidence to such a narrow margin that it would be impossible to prove that anything in life exists. I suspect this is done out of fear.
Here's a few websites that are not atheist, and any atheist would accept as credible:
If a god can heal with miracles, then why do we need doctors in the first place? There should be no need for Christian doctors if the Christian god is real. Only atheists and people worshipping false gods would need doctors.
We have had so many surveys and studies come out in the last number of months which indicate that religion is becoming of less and less importance to people, especially in the United States of America, and in many cases fading away completely.
This studies show that college students are rapidly becoming separated from any religious perspectives including the so-called spiritual.
Many of us think this is a good thing and would not be surprised if the chart you see in this story soon will start resembling a hockey stick.
In a time where secularism is at an all time high, and will probably become nearly ubiquitous within the next several years, is this any wonder?
People choose to make religion irrelevant. That does not mean that it is.
I choose to keep my faith in Christ and trust in Him. My relationship with Him stands against whatever the current popular trend is. So, while these studies may demonstrate the growing "irrelevancy" of religion (and I use this term loosely b/c I don't love of follow Christ as some sort of dogmatic superficial "religion,"), this means nothing for me personally. It does make a difference, though, for the bride of Christ as a whole...which is an entirely different issue altogether.
If a god can heal with miracles, then why do we need doctors in the first place? There should be no need for Christian doctors if the Christian god is real. Only atheists and people worshipping false gods would need doctors.
You might as well ask why did Jesus even have to die on the cross then. God could just keep this physical body living forever, right? No, the truth is that the introduction of sin into this realm put a curse of death on all living things.
If God is healing every ailment or physical problem then He is only prolonging our eventual death. After death, Christians will receive a glorified body that will never get sick or need healing.
I've read that biased article before, and it is nothing more than the perspective of a single individual who came to his event with deeply ingrained preconceived notions and a high degree of skepticism. There is nothing in his article that tells me that he went to the service with an open mind. He even says he was underwhelmed. He was hoping to see "people babbling in tongues, collapsing at the preacher’s touch, and getting up from wheelchairs believing themselves healed. " Not to witness something supernatural, but merely for his own skeptical entertainment. He says he wanted evidence of a miracle yet doesn't say one bit exactly what it would take to qualify as evidence. How did he know healing was not taking place in the body?
He claims that Wommack was "hawking" his products, but failed to mention that Wommack never begs for money on his program, and freely gives out his material to anyone who asks.
You might as well ask why did Jesus even have to die on the cross then. God could just keep this physical body living forever, right? No, the truth is that the introduction of sin into this realm put a curse of death on all living things.
If God is healing every ailment or physical problem then He is only prolonging our eventual death. After death, Christians will receive a glorified body that will never get sick or need healing.
Well that's an easy escape route. Just dismiss any source or website that is not 100% atheist. Atheists limit the parameters for evidence to such a narrow margin that it would be impossible to prove that anything in life exists. I suspect this is done out of fear.
I would be looking at it like this -----> if even Richard Dawkins said that his believe in positive power cured his stage 4 lymphoma. I believe in what can be proven through logical means, not mystical ones. Atheists don't limit the parameters; rather they require those parameters be serious and logically based. It's ones of the faith that limit parameters, because they refuse to believe it could not be based on science or a lie, but it has to all due to the God factor. I would also say the same could be said of people of faith. They believe due to a fear of dying, or more likely, a fear of having to live with the unknown.
I've read that biased article before, and it is nothing more than the perspective of a single individual who came to his event with deeply ingrained preconceived notions and a high degree of skepticism. There is nothing in his article that tells me that he went to the service with an open mind. He even says he was underwhelmed. He was hoping to see "people babbling in tongues, collapsing at the preacher’s touch, and getting up from wheelchairs believing themselves healed. " Not to witness something supernatural, but merely for his own skeptical entertainment. He says he wanted evidence of a miracle yet doesn't say one bit exactly what it would take to qualify as evidence. How did he know healing was not taking place in the body?
He claims that Wommack was "hawking" his products, but failed to mention that Wommack never begs for money on his program, and freely gives out his material to anyone who asks.
Yeah, someone who is an evangelical Christian isn't going to be anything similar or anything .
I'll make Jeff & Co a deal, as they often ask what would constitute proof of the miraculous for a skeptic. Show me a documented miracle where someone is missing one or more limbs, where god then restores the limb in real time in full view of everyone present. If you do that I will do a reboot and reconsider all my default assumptions about the miraculous.
If this is performed by an evangelical fundamentalist then I will reconsider the other truth claims of the minister in question.
Given the ease with which video can be manipulated even by amateurs these days I would want to be physically present and I would want to see the limb grow from a bare stump before my eyes, while being free to walk around in front of and behind the subject, but this should not be difficult to arrange since god can do anything.
Failing that, perform this sort of thing routinely for many witnesses and require that all subjects be vetted by independent medical examiners before and after if they want their new limbs, and allow unaffiliated journalists to cover every step, and stipulate that the before and after medical records be released to the public. Your first couple of subjects would have to be of sufficient means to afford that or you might have to subsidize them, but once word gets around, that will no longer be an obstacle.
What do you say?
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