Americans are too religious!!! (churches, abortion, faith, exist)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
For what? For posting a statement that was worded in way where it could be interpreted more broadly than intended? Instead of engaging in childish over-reactions why not challenge what you didn't like about the statement. Had you done so I would have seen how it could be misconstrued and would have revised my comment to be more precise in response to your direct and forthright expression of concern. Instead we had to watch some of you go through this overly-dramatic playacting that you should be ashamed of.
It isn't a matter of how many are religious but rather how the religious and irreligious live their values: Right now, both groups do so in a manner that is too insular, too inwardly-focused. The "proper amount" would have the dogma-driven religious turn towards doing good works to help those less fortunate, and have those irreligious turn who are in exclusive pursuit of money and fun turn toward doing good works to help those less fortunate. This is not just a matter of the doing of good works, as such, but also the change in focus also will naturally bring about a change in attitude that will affect other aspects of people's values.
For what? For posting a statement that was worded in way where it could be interpreted more broadly than intended? Instead of engaging in childish over-reactions why not challenge what you didn't like about the statement. Had you done so I would have seen how it could be misconstrued and would have revised my comment to be more precise in response to your direct and forthright expression of concern. Instead we had to watch some of you go through this overly-dramatic playacting that you should be ashamed of.
It isn't a matter of how many are religious but rather how the religious and irreligious live their values: Right now, both groups do so in a manner that is too insular, too inwardly-focused. The "proper amount" would have the dogma-driven religious turn towards doing good works to help those less fortunate, and have those irreligious turn who are in exclusive pursuit of money and fun turn toward doing good works to help those less fortunate. This is not just a matter of the doing of good works, as such, but also the change in focus also will naturally bring about a change in attitude that will affect other aspects of people's values.
Use your words, people.
Here's my words, person: I am irreligious. I also give away thousands of dollars a year to the needy. I do not declare those donations on my taxes. They are gifts.
For what? For posting a statement that was worded in way where it could be interpreted more broadly than intended? Instead of engaging in childish over-reactions why not challenge what you didn't like about the statement. Had you done so I would have seen how it could be misconstrued and would have revised my comment to be more precise in response to your direct and forthright expression of concern. Instead we had to watch you go through this overly-dramatic reaction you should be ashamed of.
It isn't a matter of how many are religious but rather how the religious and irreligious live their values: Right now, both groups do so in a manner that is too insular, too inwardly-focused. The "proper amount" would have the religious turn away from dogma and turn towards doing good works to help those less fortunate, and have those irreligious turn who are in exclusive pursuit of money and fun turn toward doing good works to help those less fortunate. This is not just a matter of the doing of good works, as such, but also the change in focus also will naturally bring about a change in attitude that will affect other aspects of people's values.
Use your words, people.
Do you know the meaning of 'exclusive'
"have those irreligious turn who are in exclusive pursuit of money and fun turn toward doing good works to help those less fortunate."
There's no other way to interpret it.
What I don't like about the statement and your subsequent statement is you have in your own words painted all the irreligious with the same insulting brush.
Here's my words, person: I am irreligious. I also give away thousands of dollars a year to the needy. I do not declare those donations on my taxes. They are gifts.
That's super. Perhaps we can work together on more good works - cooking meals at the homeless shelter, getting the bottles and cans up out of the river, etc. I look forward to seeing you join us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruithne
Do you know the meaning of 'exclusive'
Yes. That's why I used the word.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruithne
There's no other way to interpret it.
That's what I thought, but you managed to misinterpret my original statement. To be fair, your interpretation seems valid, for my first statement, but not for my second statement. But perhaps at this point you really don't care to read and just want to write without actually understanding what you're replying to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruithne
What I don't like about the statement and your subsequent statement is you have in your own words painted all the irreligious with the same insulting brush.
Except I didn't. My revision very clearly doesn't do that (and my original didn't intend to). So it really is just about you now and whether you're willing to let yourself acknowledge that.
That's super. Perhaps we can work together on more good works - cooking meals at the homeless shelter, getting the bottles and cans up out of the river, etc. I look forward to seeing you join us.
Yes. That's why I used the word.
That's what I thought, but you managed to misinterpret my original statement. To be fair, your interpretation seems valid, for my first statement, but not for my second statement. But perhaps at this point you really don't care to read and just want to write without actually understanding what you're replying to.
Except I didn't. My revision very clearly doesn't do that (and my original didn't intend to). So it really is just about you now and whether you're willing to let yourself acknowledge that.
What this is really about bUU is that you happened to be on the receiving end, of the end of my tether - I see every day on here remarks like 'how can atheists have any morals if they don't believe in god.?' and other sweeping baseless statements about the morals of atheists.
I had just read your post after I had just written this on another thread:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruithne
Here are my 4 things people don't know about atheists, based on my experience on this forum:
1. We (I) get tired of all being lumped in together as though we are all the same. We are all individuals and have very different views about things. We cant even agree on a definition of the word 'atheist' for crying out loud. When people talk about 'fundamentalist atheists' or 'militant atheists' you might as well just read 'atheists', because the type of people who use those words tend to have a very biased view of all atheists - as if we are all the same.
2. The reason many people become atheist is because they see immorality and injustice in religion. QED atheists tend to be very moral people not immoral people.
3. I'll just quote Ricky Gervais for this one: “It’s a strange myth that atheists have nothing to live for. It’s the opposite. We have nothing to die for. We have everything to live for.”
4. We don't 'hate god'. We don't believe in god! Nor do we hate people who believe in god. Most of us really don't mind what people believe.
and you confirmed what I wrote by making yet another sweeping baseless statement.
You have no idea about what goes on in peoples lives or what they do for others. You are making sweeping baseless assumptions about it.
Except I didn't. My revision very clearly doesn't do that (and my original didn't intend to). So it really is just about you now and whether you're willing to let yourself acknowledge that.
To be fair your revision looks ungrammatical, and is still a bit ambiguous, depending on whether "... who are in exclusive pursuit of money and fun..." is read as a modifier of irreligious, or a parenthetical phrase implying that this is true of all irreligious. Both your first and second attempts at that sentence can easily be read as implying that all irreligious are in exclusive pursuit of money and fun (and that religious people are not motivated by these things). Perhaps we are a bit touchy about implications that because we are not religious we are greedy, self-centered, amoral hedonists, but after seeing those kinds of accusations leveled over and over, can you really blame us?
Perhaps instead of trying pit the religious and irreligious against each other, we can simply agree that:
People in general are too insular, too inwardly-focused. This is not just a matter of the doing of good works, as such, but also the change in focus also will naturally bring about a change in attitude that will affect other aspects of people's values.
What this is really about bUU is that you happened to be on the receiving end, of the end of my tether - I see every day on here remarks like 'how can atheists have any morals if they don't believe in god.?' and other sweeping baseless statements about the morals of atheists.
Statements which, if you go back and check my posting history, you will see that I very forcefully objected to. Not that you'd be expected to know that, but it does serve as a really strong indicator that the wording I used here that led you to believe that I painted all the irreligious with the same insulting brush was a misunderstanding - poor wording on my part, remedied by my revision. Read it, you'll see.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruithne
and you confirmed what I wrote by making yet another sweeping baseless statement.
A comment that shows that you didn't read my revision, because it was the opposite of "sweeping" (and surely wasn't baseless, but that's another matter).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruithne
You have no idea about what goes on in peoples lives or what they do for others.
I have as much idea about that as you, if not more. Let's stick to the topic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoCapo
To be fair your revision looks ungrammatical, and is still a bit ambiguous, depending on whether "... who are in exclusive pursuit of money and fun..." is read as a modifier of irreligious, or a parenthetical phrase implying that this is true of all irreligious.
Hmmm... we'll have to agree to disagree about that. A parenthetical phrase would necessarily require some indication thereof. Regardless, looking back at it now, I realize that there is a duplicate word in the wrong place ("turn"). I'm not proofreading what I write as much as I should today.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoCapo
Perhaps instead of trying pit the religious and irreligious against each other, we can simply agree that:
People in general are too insular, too inwardly-focused. This is not just a matter of the doing of good works, as such, but also the change in focus also will naturally bring about a change in attitude that will affect other aspects of people's values.
And yet we are almost always the first country to respond to these other countries needs in times of difficulty or disaster. We are not a selfish nation. Maybe that's because America has adopted the biblical principles that it is better to give than receive.
I bet the Europeans would stop laughing if we cut off all aid.
Is that true or is it mostly due to American news being very poor at reporting what other countries do? I am not saying that the US is not generous when a crisis or natural disaster occurs but if I watch US news I see little or no mention in reference to aid coming from other countries whereas if I watch CBC or BBC I get a totally different take on this matter.
Cuba is usually quick to offer medical aid such as doctors and I doubt they are on bibical principles, perhaps it is simply human principles that come into play.
How many European countries are you giving aid to?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
