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A Muslim works in a Muslim owned slaughterhouse. Their main production is Halal meat for the Muslim market. The Muslim converts to Christianity and declares that when he slaughters an animal he has to do so "in the name of Jesus".which renders it non-Halal. For religious beliefs He can no longer just say "in the name of God" His employer agrees to let him switch with other workers and package for them and they slaughter for him.
He comes to work one day and his coworker refuses to switch. He refuses to slaughter.
Does the employer have the right to fire him?
Yes however that would be considered persecution of Christians. It would be much more clear if he converted to Buddist or an atheist or perhaps even Mormon or possibliy Catholic.
I am an non believer who happens to be Jewish. Where can I find a job as a pork taster? Bacon, ham and spare ribs are my specialty.
Going back to the baker if the baker who owned the bakery had a baker working for him and that employee refused to bake the wedding cake the baker could fire him or assign him to a different job baking bread or whatever. He could not put him in jail or fine him. How do these experts on the law defending the clerk or the baker not be able to grasp this simple common law bit? And why are they not complaining that the flight attendent should not be forced to serve booze on the flight? Should not the entire plane or airline be alchohol free because of her religious freedom. Customers could always go on another airline. But no the then claim that there are being presecuted because they have to follow the law but that the Muslim who broke no laws should be jailed?
I, too am Jewish by heritage (but do not follow the religion) and I LOVE my bacon, ham, spareribs & pork chops.
Side note, my grandmother lived in a Jewish retirement community. When we were in town, we took her out to lunch and she ordered a ham sandwich. I said, "Not very kosher, Grandma." She just smiled and said all the residents do that when they go out to eat. Gotta get their pork fix since they can't get it in the retirement community.
A Muslim works in a Muslim owned slaughterhouse. Their main production is Halal meat for the Muslim market. The Muslim converts to Christianity and declares that when he slaughters an animal he has to do so "in the name of Jesus".which renders it non-Halal. For religious beliefs He can no longer just say "in the name of God" His employer agrees to let him switch with other workers and package for them and they slaughter for him.
He comes to work one day and his coworker refuses to switch. He refuses to slaughter.
Does the employer have the right to fire him?
If the employee is not able to perform the work required of him, yes. He should be let go.
I, too am Jewish by heritage (but do not follow the religion) and I LOVE my bacon, ham, spareribs & pork chops.
Side note, my grandmother lived in a Jewish retirement community. When we were in town, we took her out to lunch and she ordered a ham sandwich. I said, "Not very kosher, Grandma." She just smiled and said all the residents do that when they go out to eat. Gotta get their pork fix since they can't get it in the retirement community.
Cat
My grandfather went out for bacon and eggs Sunday mornings. My grandmother would not eat pork in any form. When my mother was young they lived on a farm and when her sister would go over to a neighbours house their grandmother would ask what they ate and my aunt always said chicken no matter what was served. My mother on the other hand always said pork no matter what was served. We ate pork and had milk with every meal. Silly rules as far as I am concerned. Thanks Mom and Dad for not being silly with our food (other than canned spagetti that was real silly)
Hypothetical case.
A Muslim works in a Muslim owned slaughterhouse. Their main production is Halal meat for the Muslim market. The Muslim converts to Christianity and declares that when he slaughters an animal he has to do so "in the name of Jesus".which renders it non-Halal. For religious beliefs He can no longer just say "in the name of God" His employer agrees to let him switch with other workers and package for them and they slaughter for him.
He comes to work one day and his coworker refuses to switch. He refuses to slaughter.
Does the employer have the right to fire him?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio
If the employee is not able to perform the work required of him, yes. He should be let go.
Vizio is correct, Wood. There is no reason why ANY religious concern should affect the performance of one's job, period. Religion is entirely personal and has no role in job performance.
My grandfather went out for bacon and eggs Sunday mornings. My grandmother would not eat pork in any form. When my mother was young they lived on a farm and when her sister would go over to a neighbours house their grandmother would ask what they ate and my aunt always said chicken no matter what was served. My mother on the other hand always said pork no matter what was served. We ate pork and had milk with every meal. Silly rules as far as I am concerned. Thanks Mom and Dad for not being silly with our food (other than canned spagetti that was real silly)
My great-grandfather & grandfather, who were SUPPOSED to be kosher, used to go to a Chinese restaurant every Sunday and order sweet & sour pork. I guess if it is Chinese, it must have been kosher pork.
yes, because she is unwilling to fulfill her job duties
actually, she should quit her job
if she really cared about being an observant Muslim she would quit the job because she is forbidden to work where alcohol is served, even if someone else is serving it
so see...it's not really about religious observance at all is it?
the best religious accommodation of all would be for the employer to state since you are Muslim you are not allowed to work in a company that handles alcohol so we are accommodating you by your having no job here.
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 09-09-2015 at 06:13 PM..
However, if there was an agreement that she would not have to serve alcohol, the airline should have stuck to what was agreed upon.
I am curious about this as I do not know the law in the area where this took place. But you seem to believe that attempts at accommodation can become part of the permanent job description. I am genuinely curious to read some citation of the law that shows this to be true, because it sounds false to me.
I certainly know that in my country of birth and current country of residence, that employers and employees are free to negotiate alterations and accommodations at will. They can even decide if they feel like it that they will just put their feet up and do nothing at all if it suits all parties involved. Gentlemans agreement and all that.
But they are not made an actual real part of the job description, in practice or in law, unless an actual document is signed by both parties acknowledging a real legal change.
The idea, which you have suggested on occasion in the thread, that putting in place an accommodation automatically makes it part of the job description of that person..... I will simply have to file under "unsubstantiated" for now and happily await an education on what local law is to the event in question on the thread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI
Does the employer have the right to fire him?
To be honest all the religious background you gave you your hypothetical situation is irrelevant white noise and red herrings to me. The only questions for me in any situation of this sort is:
1) What job was the person hired for and signed up for?
2) Is that person performing that job and to standard?
I am curious about this as I do not know the law in the area where this took place. But you seem to believe that attempts at accommodation can become part of the permanent job description. I am genuinely curious to read some citation of the law that shows this to be true, because it sounds false to me.
I certainly know that in my country of birth and current country of residence, that employers and employees are free to negotiate alterations and accommodations at will. They can even decide if they feel like it that they will just put their feet up and do nothing at all if it suits all parties involved. Gentlemans agreement and all that.
But they are not made an actual real part of the job description, in practice or in law, unless an actual document is signed by both parties acknowledging a real legal change.
The idea, which you have suggested on occasion in the thread, that putting in place an accommodation automatically makes it part of the job description of that person..... I will simply have to file under "unsubstantiated" for now and happily await an education on what local law is to the event in question on the thread.
To be honest all the religious background you gave you your hypothetical situation is irrelevant white noise and red herrings to me. The only questions for me in any situation of this sort is:
1) What job was the person hired for and signed up for?
2) Is that person performing that job and to standard?
I agree with your points 1 & 2.
I also agree with this:
Quote:
But they are not made an actual real part of the job description, in practice or in law, unless an actual document is signed by both parties acknowledging a real legal change.
I believe what I have been saying is that if an actual document was signed, there is no basis for the firing. That is the part I do not know from the article, was there or was there not an actual agreement or was this a local level trial basis agreement.
So she shouldn't have to resign? Shouldn't be sent to jail for refusing to serve someone in a public business?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
Only if she is a Christian.
If you are referring to Kentucky Clerk Kim Davis then please know that she was sent to jail because she could not have been fired because she is an elected official who refused to follow Federal orders.
You can't "fire" elected officials. The way to stop them for performing their duties is send them to jail.
The hostess in this case is NOT an officially elected entity so she was fired.
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