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With beliefs so different I would think that a member of any of these groups must think all the others are looney. The Scientologists and Mormons seem the craziest to me with their recently formed religions but that's probably because of the way I was raised (southern Baptist). I was taught that all other beliefs lacking acceptance of Jesus as Lord and Saviour, even Catholics, were going to Hell. Maybe they are. Maybe none are. The Baptists had zero allowable tolerances when it came to salvation so I've always figured they all do.
I try not to be judgmental, but it's difficult not to be aware of all of the negativity surrounding Scientology. I've seen a few documentaries that examined Scientology as a group - as opposed to their theological beliefs, and I found many of their practices in terms of how they treat and discipline their members to be disturbing.
However, I do not dislike people who are involved in Scientology.
I don't think any of the others are "loony". I just don't spend a lot of time judging the belief systems of other people.
There is an entire thread about it with an Einstein's quote
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What do you think? Was Einstein " misled and indoctrinated into an indefensible belief system" OR, you are a Fanatical Atheist?
Are those the only 2 choices? Maybe fanatics of anything have a personality disorder. A good indicator is if a person employs splitting. Some people fail to recognize there may be more than one way to look at things.
Splitting, or all-or-nothing-thinking, has always been considered a borderline trait. But like emptiness, it commonly occurs in people with narcissistic personality disorder as well.
What do you think? Was Einstein " misled and indoctrinated into an indefensible belief system" OR, you are a Fanatical Atheist?
I think you took Einstein entirely out of context. Not that you would ever admit it.
And keep in mind ... the chains he speaks of people struggling to be rid of ... come from the sort of religion you espouse. He was no friend of fundamentalist Christianity and in fact explicitly stated that such beliefs are childish. Einstein said a lot of things you wouldn't like, so I don't think you really want to be quotemining him for support.
Are those the only 2 choices? Maybe fanatics of anything have a personality disorder. A good indicator is if a person employs splitting.
That's what I am saying to Shirina. Why limit fanaticism only to "evangelism, and certain baptist denominations"?
There are fanatics in Atheists too (at least according to Einstein). How about we address them as well while we are at it, or perhaps there are no fanatics in Atheists?
I don't like the term agnostic being used to describe people because it lets them off the hook on having to make a decision about whether or not they think there is a god. "I don't know" isn't good enough. If someone really thinks about it, the person will either think there is a god or think there isn't a god. Someone who thinks about this and continues to say "I don't know," is really saying "I don't want to think."
How do the terms agnostic (don't know) and gnostic (know) fit in?
They are to be used as adjective to describe both the believers and nonbelievers. For someone who thinks there is a god (a theist) agnostic and gnostic describe how much he or she thinks that. Same for someone who doesn't think there is no god (an atheist).
Phrasing it another way, gnostic and agnostic describe the level of knowledge, the extent to which someone thinks they know, or the level of the certainty, that there is or is no god. Gnostic means you think you know for sure. Agnostic means you admit you don't know for sure.
So....
A gnostic atheist thinks there is no god, and claims to know this with certainty, proof or not.
An agnostic atheist thinks there is no god, yet acknowledges they can't know this with certainty because it can't be proved.
A gnostic theist thinks there is a god, and claims to know this with certainty, proof or not.
An agnostic theist thinks there is a god, yet acknowledges they can't know this with certainty because it can't be proved.
Were I to be Grammar Queen of the World, I would do away with the use of the words gnostic and agnostic as nouns and treat them only as adjectives. The words atheist and theist are nouns, to be qualified and modified by the adjectives gnostic and agnostic.
Even though I may not like how the word agnostic is used, I understand why it is used as a noun. It describes someone who sits on the fence and chooses to not make a decision as to whether or not they think there is or isn't a god, purportedly because they simply can't know. I see this as getting a pass on deciding whether or not one thinks there is a god.
If you don't think there is a god, then logic would say you think there is a god. But even if you refuse to take either position and refuse to decide what you think about this, you're still going to live your life as if there is a god or as if there isn't. You may go back and forth, which is the equivalent of hedging your bets when you feel like it. It boils down to not being able to have it both ways, if you want to use your brain.
That's what I am saying to Shirina. Why limit fanaticism only to "evangelism, and certain baptist denominations"?
There are fanatics in Atheists too (at least according to Einstein). How about we address them as well while we are at it, or perhaps there are no fanatics in Atheists?
I specifically included atheists in the title of the thread. You have answered at least part of the question. You think atheists are crazy. How about the other two to which you don't belong? Crazy or do they deserve a little more consideration since they at least have belief even if wrong? That brings up another question; Are atheists/agnostics more reviled by believers than practitioners of differing (untrue) religions?
Everyone's beliefs sound kind of crazy to people who don't believe them. But I'd say that no matter how rational or irrational the priest's beliefs (and the beliefs of his followers) were, they couldn't begin to compare to the beliefs of the 900 people who committed suicide at Jim Jones' command. To me, the "fatal consequences," which destroyed the lives of the misguided people as Jonestown constitute such a degree of insanity that to compare that incident with 99% of the world's religions -- no matter how crazy you may think they are -- is just taking it too far.
"Taking it too far" is a vague term, where is the line established?
The above would seem to be agreeing that it is a matter of degrees, but is it sanity/insanity, insanity/greater insanity, harmless sanity/dangerous sanity, harmless insanity/dangerous insanity?
As I noted, you are basing your response on the outcome of the beliefs, not on the beliefs themselves.
Person A believes that he must wear a tinfoil hat to ward off alien mind control rays. Person B believes that the creator of the entire universe decided to come to Earth and slum around as a Jewish peasant 2000 years ago.
The Bible is more than a book. It's the word of God. As such, I want to read it, study it and meditate upon it. Don't you?
Sometimes. I don't need a book to find God. You do? Good for you. Why on earth would you think others have to? I suspect it's because you've been trained to think that.
God does not confine Himself to the Bible. I'm not going to immerse myself in ANY book telling me about God when I can go outside and look at a sky full stars.
I try not to be judgmental, but it's difficult not to be aware of all of the negativity surrounding Scientology. I've seen a few documentaries that examined Scientology as a group - as opposed to their theological beliefs, and I found many of their practices in terms of how they treat and discipline their members to be disturbing.
I lived near their HQ in Hollywood. Their recruiters are relentless....and not too bright considering they never seem to pick up on the fact they are accosting the same people over and over....
"Dude. I said "No" ten minutes ago. I didn't change my mind while I was inside Sav-On buying batteries."
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