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My point is that the self-esteem movement of telling everyone they're just spanky just really hasn't resulted in anything productive. Take a look around. We got mass shootings going on. We don't dare walk the streets at night in some cities. Wars, etc. Life on this planet is not getting better. People are more and more selfish. We've had protesting in the streets the last few years by people that want what others have. We got a university president in Missouri being tossed out because he didn't react strong enough to an anonymous insult and some rich kid bully got a bunch of people riled up. No...telling people they're wonderful doesn't help anything.
But....we are all worthy of love and respect. I tell my kids every day that I love them. But the fact is that God has also stated that we have all sinned and deserve punishment. The good news is that we don't have to face that punishment.
I'm sorry if it doesn't. I'm willing to live and let live. I don't go on atheist forums and chide them for their disbelief. I don't put up billboards telling them they're stupid. I don't attack them for wanting a particular monument that means something to their culture.
This thread is about atheists that can't stand to just let Christians live their lives. The militant type of atheist that says he wants to be left alone...but then goes on an offensive against everyone that dares to show any religious expression. If that isn't you? Great. But there are plenty like that on this board alone--guys that DAILY post attacks on religion.
All I hear from you is crying that fundies are losing their grip on America and that minorities are finding, and using, their voice.
You know your particular brand of Christianity is considered vile by most of the world and the fact you are seeing it die in front of your eyes makes you sad.
Boo-hoo-hoo.
Tonight, under a starry, unbelievably mild December sky, I will go outside and dance a clumsy but heartfelt *** to celebrate fundamentalism's death throes.
ETA: Apparently, j-i-g is considered a naughty word here. LOL.
My point is that the self-esteem movement of telling everyone they're just spanky just really hasn't resulted in anything productive. Take a look around. We got mass shootings going on. We don't dare walk the streets at night in some cities. Wars, etc. Life on this planet is not getting better. People are more and more selfish. We've had protesting in the streets the last few years by people that want what others have. We got a university president in Missouri being tossed out because he didn't react strong enough to an anonymous insult and some rich kid bully got a bunch of people riled up. No...telling people they're wonderful doesn't help anything.
So the problems we are having pointed up are all down to atheists being vocal. Whodathunkit. I'm suggesting that we badly need a new way of social thinking at the present ways seem to be falling badly short.
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I'm sorry if it doesn't. I'm willing to live and let live. I don't go on atheist forums and chide them for their disbelief. I don't put up billboards telling them they're stupid. I don't attack them for wanting a particular monument that means something to their culture.
This thread is about atheists that can't stand to just let Christians live their lives. The militant type of atheist that says he wants to be left alone...but then goes on an offensive against everyone that dares to show any religious expression. If that isn't you? Great. But there are plenty like that on this board alone--guys that DAILY post attacks on religion.
I posted on this. Just being left alone 9which isn't what we are getting at the moment) is not enough. Yes, there has to be a change in worldview. That's why we are vocal and doing what we do.
The best society where you will get that is one where no one religion dominates. That means a non religious society. We are working for the good of the religious too, though they don't see it like that.
I have to agree that a creed that has as a teaching that man is "Rotten to the Core" is a rotten -to -the -core teaching and creed in itself.
Wow Christianity is now child abuse? That's a gross distortion considering that the creed of atheism is essentially a devaluing of humanity. Boiled down to the bone of atheism, we are not uniquely created, but just cogs of the machinery of life, worm food in the end that will most likely be forgotten by future generations. Such hopelessness is not what society needs.
Wow Christianity is now child abuse? That's a gross distortion considering that the creed of atheism is essentially a devaluing of humanity. Boiled down to the bone of atheism, we are not uniquely created, but just cogs of the machinery of life, worm food in the end that will most likely be forgotten by future generations. Such hopelessness is not what society needs.
So basically, you believe in God so you can feel special?
What is your point? I do not go to church on Christmas, or any other day. I am not an Atheist.
If someone puts up a bill board you object to, think of it differently. Someone paid a bunch of money to put up their message, and someone designed, and installed it. It keeps them in business and puts money into the economy.
My point is that the self-esteem movement of telling everyone they're just spanky just really hasn't resulted in anything productive. Take a look around. We got mass shootings going on. We don't dare walk the streets at night in some cities. Wars, etc. Life on this planet is not getting better. People are more and more selfish. We've had protesting in the streets the last few years by people that want what others have. We got a university president in Missouri being tossed out because he didn't react strong enough to an anonymous insult and some rich kid bully got a bunch of people riled up. No...telling people they're wonderful doesn't help anything.
It actually has hindered things, creating entitled pricks that believe they don't need to answer to anyone because Mommy has told them how great they are.
I just got done with some lady that had a lousy 60c fine, who squawked about "the principle of the thing." Seriously, lady, one, I don't care one way or another, it's a small fine and I didn't call you, meaning I'd just as well the library ignored you until you had a fine of at least $6.00. Two, I'm cool with forgiving your fine if you have a better attitude and don't berate me on the phone for 20 min. Three, we shouldn't be taking books from this area, because they are always late by at least three days (I have no way of knowing what books actually are, and what books people tell me are). Four, I have trouble believing it takes 3 days to get books from a drop.
I don't think everyone DOES need to believe in God. I do believe we need a sort of morality system that emphasizes personal boundaries instead of "good" and "evil". As in, for ****s sake, if someone says you're not allowed in their house don't be a stalker. Don't take stuff that doesn't belong to you, and don't hurt other people.
It isn't healthy to have people who beat themselves up. But it is even less healthy This is a disservice to children, because it produces adults unwilling to take responsibility. "The principle of the thing" is that you should pay your dues, just as I should try to take care of debts. This woman to my memory did not ever ask politely if I could waive her fines, she launched into a diatribe about how I had to pay off your debts because "this is the third time this happened." I didn't check you in, a coworker did. I didn't call you either. The "principle of the thing" is that there are people with worse debts that you, and I'm cool with forgiving $2.00 or $3.00 if you can give me a good excuse. But your first impulse is to bully and harrass me over the phone. I don't take well to bullying, my guard goes up and I refuse everything.
This is what happens when people tell you that you're a good person, even when you're being a rude entitled twit.
Here's the point of all this, besides me venting about a somewhat crappy day. Jesus didn't speak in depth about sin, but rather "love your neighbor as yourself." Because seriously, religion or not, this is the only law that matters. Would you want to endure pressuring over the phone?
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The best society where you will get that is one where no one religion dominates. That means a non religious society. We are working for the good of the religious too, though they don't see it like that.
I call bull here.
A society where no one religion dominates is in theory already attainable by having a government hands off approach. And the second sentence does not equal the first. Atheism is a religious worldview, even if it is not a religion. A non-religious society, on the other hand, is oppressive to all religions. What is needed is not a "non religious society" but a "religiously apathetic society".
My point is that the self-esteem movement of telling everyone they're just spanky just really hasn't resulted in anything productive. Take a look around. We got mass shootings going on. We don't dare walk the streets at night in some cities. Wars, etc. Life on this planet is not getting better. People are more and more selfish. We've had protesting in the streets the last few years by people that want what others have. We got a university president in Missouri being tossed out because he didn't react strong enough to an anonymous insult and some rich kid bully got a bunch of people riled up. No...telling people they're wonderful doesn't help anything.
I don't think wars, shootings, and selfishness are a recent phenomenon.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
But....we are all worthy of love and respect. I tell my kids every day that I love them. But the fact is that God has also stated that we have all sinned and deserve punishment. The good news is that we don't have to face that punishment.
That's sick and twisted on so many different levels.
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Originally Posted by Vizio
I'm sorry if it doesn't. I'm willing to live and let live. I don't go on atheist forums and chide them for their disbelief. I don't put up billboards telling them they're stupid. I don't attack them for wanting a particular monument that means something to their culture.
This thread is about atheists that can't stand to just let Christians live their lives. The militant type of atheist that says he wants to be left alone...but then goes on an offensive against everyone that dares to show any religious expression. If that isn't you? Great. But there are plenty like that on this board alone--guys that DAILY post attacks on religion.
Trying to force creationism into public schools is not "just letting Christians live their lives."
The conservative Protestants are losing the cultural hegemony they have had since the founding of the USA, and they don't like it. "Religious freedom" no longer means "the right for my religion to rule the day."
Wow Christianity is now child abuse? That's a gross distortion considering that the creed of atheism is essentially a devaluing of humanity. Boiled down to the bone of atheism, we are not uniquely created, but just cogs of the machinery of life, worm food in the end that will most likely be forgotten by future generations. Such hopelessness is not what society needs.
Atheism <> nihilism. Learn the difference.
The irony is that a nihilistic reaction to life is a not-uncommon short-term effect of people deconverting from the Abrahamic faiths, because they are so conditioned to think that their faith is essential to both hope and morality. Most people figure out that's not the case at all, and adjust. A few do not; but I lay that at the feet of theism.
Hope is not derivable from being "uniquely created". It is derived from our actual abilities and influence, which exist regardless of how they came about.
You will ultimately be forgotten worm food regardless of whether you imagine otherwise or not; but what you do that future generations choose to value and remember, however imperfectly, is still your legacy. My late wife is not even worm food, she is ash mixed with soil -- but she lives on in my memory and that of her extended family. When I am gone her influence will echo indirectly through the things I or my children or others who knew me or her set in motion because of her influence.
That actual legacy is not made more valuable by immortality. In fact it is devalued by it. People who truly think they will live forever are the ones who don't have to try very hard to make an impact in the only life they actually have, because they always have the afterlife for their unfinished business.
Thankfully even most people who believe they are immortal do so in a compartmentalized way; they still treat the only life they actually have as it should be: as the only life that matters. At some level they aren't sure of their immortality. They grieve just like everyone else. They Move On, remarry and generally act like this life is all there is.
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