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Thanks Gldnrule. Your post will show to my pal Tzaph (who I admire and respect greatly) how his well - meaning but misguided defence of mother Thersa's memory (or the one that people want to have of her, and never mind the facts) becomes an attack on anyone putting the contrary view. Which gives people in your camp the excuse to leap out and stir in a bit of polemic poison to the personal jabbing.
Tzaph is not "misguided" on this issue...Tzaph understands.
This thread has been a real eye-opener...and has revealed the true character and general attitude & demeanor of some of the contributors to this board toward Theism and related.
Nasty and miserable is, as nasty and miserable says and does.
As typical, the people criticizing are doing exactly what they accuse...intentionally doing what they know facilitates pain and misery in others, under the guise of helping to bring about "understanding".
Nope. In fact, the author has no idea what a meta study is, otherwise s would night have made the comments he did.
Quote from the article I linked:
As a result, the three researchers collected 502 documents on the life and work of Mother Teresa. After eliminating 195 duplicates, they consulted 287 documents to conduct their analysis, representing 96% of the literature on the founder of the Order of the Missionaries of Charity (OMC).
Nope. In fact, the author has no idea what a meta study is, otherwise s would night have made the comments he did.
Quote from the article I linked:
As a result, the three researchers collected 502 documents on the life and work of Mother Teresa. After eliminating 195 duplicates, they consulted 287 documents to conduct their analysis, representing 96% of the literature on the founder of the Order of the Missionaries of Charity (OMC).
So you read this study yourself, cupper?
Not an article about the study - the actual study?
Snowball7, you and I won't agree on much biblically--but when it comes to a realistic appraisal of MT, your link puts a hole in the bottom of the Bash a Dead Person boat.
What this entire thread shows--is that atheists/agnostics are as capable of being "snowed" under by a couple of wild claims as they are so quick to point out about fundamentalist christians of the Slick persuasion. Makes no difference that I provided two links with quotes of people who were actually WITH her during her life, they choose to believe pundits.
It's sad about fundamentalists, and even sadder to see coming from those that tout they only believe "evidence," no reliable source which any of them are able to provide.
You are smarter than that, mordant. You refuse to see that what you seek to do is damage an EXISTING positive and inspirational meme and replace it with your ugly, negative and destructive one for reasons only you are privy to. What do you want this ugliness to do for humanity???
Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant
It is MT's ugliness. There are lots of ugly realities in the world. Don't shoot the messenger.
I don't like ugliness either but it is what it is.
You are ignoring the question. As the messenger you have some goal that you wish to accomplish by spreading this ugliness around. What is it???
Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant
It is reality based and not false.
That has NOT been established and given the closeted nature of the RCC, it is unlikely that it can be. Clearly it matches your preferred view of MT.
Quote:
You appear to be of the opinion that a positive impression, however erroneous, is more important than an accurate one. I have always felt that dealing in reality produces overall superior results.
I find this idealistic nonsense to be quite annoying because the little untruths most of us routinely engage in for social lubrication reasons belie it.
Quote:
In any case I am not demonizing MT so much as taking her down off her Pedestal of Worship (tm).
WHY???
Quote:
She did some nice things and largely meant well ... but also did some really bad things and, I think, given the rationalizations provided by her belief system, justified them as conformant to dogma rather than moral in terms of societal mores and human rights.
Who hasn't??
Quote:
I don't give her a zero or negative score ... maybe 25 out of 100. I would be delighted if people would quit giving her a score of 100 as if she were entitled to it. If society could cut it down to a dull roar of like, 75, that would at least leave some room for objectivity instead of slathering hero worship.
I do not understand why this bothers you so much that you want to destroy an existing positive and inspirational image and societal influence.
That is the ACCUSATION by those who hate her for unknown reasons. This is disingenuous as you probably thrive on little social untruths in your daily interactions to avoid hurting others or being hurt yourself. Most of us do, but we tend to want to have actual evidence to base them on, not accusations or opinions.
Good luck. don't hold your breath, JerZ.
I cannot understand why anyone would want to destroy something that has a positive impact on the masses merely to scratch some itch about some unverified and unverifiable truth. The Catholic Church is notoriously closeted and any actual information about them and their finances and operations are simply NOT available. I can understand the animosity toward it, but this smear campaign is in another league altogether.
Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodynew
So this PERFECT person has a conspiracy of unknown haters? That makes more sense to you?
NO ONE is perfect so this absurd straw man has no legs, but Yes, clearly she has haters not all of whom are known.
Quote:
Not so much. I don't need to lie to be kind.
You just did, IMO. If you have had ANY kind of actual social life, you have indeed lied, remember omission is a lie as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cupper3
I could give a rip about the RCC, the issue is MT is held up by many, night just Catholics, as an example of good.
She wasn't.
She was orthodox in her belief, thought suffering was a good thing, and refused to use the massive funds she raised for the people in her care, many who did not have to die.
That is sinful, wrong, and needs to be denigrated, not cheered.
How is having someone to look up to and inspire others to do good or support good (not just Catholics) a bad thing???? YOU don't think she was good and agree with a minority of other MT-bashers. You have no evidence. You are joining a smear campaign that also has no evidence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cupper3
Many links have been given here in this thread. I can't help it if you choose to ignore them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cupper3
Sorry Dew, choosing to ignore what has being provided by me and others in this thread is whose fault?
If ANYONE has actually obtained and evaluated the financial records of the order and the Vatican or officially investigated the practices of the order, I would love to see the evidence because I do not think it is possible. IMO, the rumors about Mafia money laundering are in the same category as these smears against MT and equally without evidence. I do not know what all the motives are of those spreading this poison, but they are NOT positive and serve no good purpose.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GldnRule
Tzaph is not "misguided" on this issue...Tzaph understands.
This thread has been a real eye-opener...and has revealed the true character and general attitude & demeanor of some of the contributors to this board toward Theism and related.
Nasty and miserable is, as nasty and miserable says and does.
As typical, the people criticizing are doing exactly what they accuse...intentionally doing what they know facilitates pain and misery in others, under the guise of helping to bring about "understanding".
Sadly, I must agree with this, Gldn. It is depressing to see. I held many of them in very high regard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cupper3
Nope. In fact, the author has no idea what a meta study is, otherwise s would night have made the comments he did.
Quote from the article I linked: As a result, the three researchers collected 502 documents on the life and work of Mother Teresa. After eliminating 195 duplicates, they consulted 287 documents to conduct their analysis, representing 96% of the literature on the founder of the Order of the Missionaries of Charity (OMC).
YOU do not know what a meta-study IS and its place in the pantheon of science. Sifting through and compiling things written about someone and their order and presenting the accusations and conclusions of a specific subset is NOT science, just as metaphysics is NOT physics. The conclusions fit your preferred view of MT so you pretend it is evidence. It is NOT!
I do not know what all the motives are of those spreading this poison, but they are NOT positive and serve no good purpose.
Motives? She was a Catholic. That's enough to bring out a lot of vitriol*.
She had her detractors within India, while she was nursing people dying of leprosy , who didn't like the fact a Christian was working among the poor in a non-Christian nation. She touched the untouchables. She broke class barriers. She brought nuns into her Indian hospices. That made some people nuts. It still does.
*Not a reference to any poster(s) on this thread.
Last edited by DewDropInn; 12-22-2015 at 04:35 PM..
Location: In a little house on the prairie - literally
10,202 posts, read 7,920,960 times
Reputation: 4561
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
........
YOU do not know what a meta-study IS and its place in the pantheon of science. Sifting through and compiling things written about someone and their order and presenting the accusations and conclusions of a specific subset is NOT science, just as metaphysics is NOT physics. The conclusions fit your preferred view of MT so you pretend it is evidence. It is NOT!
Actually, I do. I spent a couple of decades being involved in policy decisions based on scientific studies.
Actually, I do. I spent a couple of decades being involved in policy decisions based on scientific studies.
Holding a position does not necessarily equate to being competent at it.
One of the greatest impediments to a fair critique of anything is personal bias.
I have seen very few as completely saturated in bias and prejudice as you...and moved to proclaim it. You are the poster child for it...and this thread (as well as the hundreds of other Theism bashing threads you've created) is the light shining on the poster.
Location: In a little house on the prairie - literally
10,202 posts, read 7,920,960 times
Reputation: 4561
Quote:
Originally Posted by GldnRule
Holding a position does not necessarily equate to being competent at it.
One of the greatest impediments to a fair critique of anything is personal bias.
I have seen very few as completely saturated in bias and prejudice as you...and moved to proclaim it. You are the poster child for it...and this thread (as well as the hundreds of other Theism bashing threads you've created) is the light shining on the poster.
Yes. I am intrigued that grown adults who no longer believe in leprechauns, Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny still believe in myths perpetuated from a number of thousands of years ago.
And come up with a plethora of reasons why they should believe in their myths. Talking about poster boys, you're one of them.
Worse is those who purport to be in authority, who then abuse that authority invoking harm on to others. That harm could be financial, that harm could be physical, that harm could be sexual, or that harm could be done by purposely not assisting someone, instead invoking their faith and incantations just like a jungle witch doctor.
I find it unfortunate that it is a target rich environment which keeps showing its ugly head. I only report it.
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