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Personally I am, in principle, willing to consider Christianty's claims of transformed lives on more of an overall basis. But ... sadly, Christians are not under-represented in prison populations, evangelicals have higher divorce rates, etc.
Besides, when you consider the extravagant claims of Christianity concerning being "made new" and getting "discernment" via the Holy Spirit, etc., you really do have to wonder about extreme examples like this. The OP is right, these guys should never get hired in the first place. Lightning bolts from heaven should fry them for even making pretense to godly leadership. Yet somehow, they not only get hired on a regular basis, they are often excused and enabled and their crimes swept under the rug.
Of course that is always Someone Else doing it; it could never happen at MY church.
And yet ... it does. My childhood church hired a pastor whose last name, ironically, was Kindheart. He was anything but. Split the church, took off with the funds and half the members, saying he was going South to "build a tabernacle" someplace. Eventually his followers came back, thoroughly fleeced. A classic con man who made it past the "discernment" of our Board of Elders. My guess is that he was cheap and charismatic, and that carried the day. He promised to liven up our moribund little country church, and in a sense, boy did he deliver.
They have a tough sheriff in Maricopa County that sets up a tent- city desert -like- dwelling for inmates and feeds them out-of date bologna. I hope this individual(won't call him pastor) gets fleeced while in prison as inmates like to confiscate others commissary. If he does the fleecing himself, he will have to answer to Bubba, a sad day that will be. He better find the good book and stick to scripture.
It really is time that an independent screening board be set up for all of these "men of god" who have and keep falling by the wayside. The religious privilege needs to stop.
Using his church to manufacture drugs? (His brother was arrested for a similar charge running a drug operation in Sheriff Arpaio's Maricopa County). Seriously, where is the screening, and I mean deep screening, that occurs? Why are the churches not stepping up and looking at these guys before they even get accepted into seminaries, never mind preaching.
Arggggh.....
You don't have to be religious to be a bad person, but it helps!
I'm aware of that, but it seems many of the evangelicals hold him up as a virtue of how justice should be done, especially against those darn illegal Mexicans.
His fans have bought into what he sells (himself) and turn a blind eye to his law-breaking and malfeasance. There are none so blind and those who will not see.
It really is time that an independent screening board be set up for all of these "men of god" who have and keep falling by the wayside. The religious privilege needs to stop.
Using his church to manufacture drugs? (His brother was arrested for a similar charge running a drug operation in Sheriff Arpaio's Maricopa County). Seriously, where is the screening, and I mean deep screening, that occurs? Why are the churches not stepping up and looking at these guys before they even get accepted into seminaries, never mind preaching.
Arggggh.....
It's a sad day when unbelievers masquerade as pastors and give Christians a bad name.
I have no idea what this guy's credentials look like. I can tell you that I did have to apply to seminary and my life was looked at by the profs when I was there. I did an internship in a church, and in the past 3 years I have been accountable to a number of other pastors. When I go before my ordination council next month I will be questioned on my life.
The sad thing is though, it's like any other area of life--there will be impostors.
It's a sad day when unbelievers masquerade as pastors and give Christians a bad name.
I have no idea what this guy's credentials look like. I can tell you that I did have to apply to seminary and my life was looked at by the profs when I was there. I did an internship in a church, and in the past 3 years I have been accountable to a number of other pastors. When I go before my ordination council next month I will be questioned on my life.
The sad thing is though, it's like any other area of life--there will be impostors.
Yet every day a new group take to the air waves and other assorted media and set up shop and start the cycle all over again--selling salvation for dollars and fear for prayers...
Yet every day a new group take to the air waves and other assorted media and set up shop and start the cycle all over again--selling salvation for dollars and fear for prayers...
OK? And why do you believe that represents Christianity? Guys like you claim we don't do enough to condemn them. The sad fact is, when we DO condemn them and say they're wrong and that they're fleecing the flock, and that there IS a difference between charlatans and Christians, then we get people telling us we can't judge and that anyone that claims to be a Christian ought to be taken at their word. So which is it?
Can we or can we not actually agree that words have meanings and that sometimes people will falsely claim to represent a religion?
Location: In a little house on the prairie - literally
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vizio
OK? And why do you believe that represents Christianity? Guys like you claim we don't do enough to condemn them. The sad fact is, when we DO condemn them and say they're wrong and that they're fleecing the flock, and that there IS a difference between charlatans and Christians, then we get people telling us we can't judge and that anyone that claims to be a Christian ought to be taken at their word. So which is it?
Can we or can we not actually agree that words have meanings and that sometimes people will falsely claim to represent a religion?
Vizio, I'm pretty sure that among normal, good Christians, that they cannot agree how to represent the religion. We wouldn't have all the different sects if we did. Heck, even the Anabaptists have 3 or more different interpretations on how to proceed. You have at least 2 groups of Mennonites, 3 groups of Hutterites, and even the Amish are segmenting, all with different approaches what it means to be an Anabaptist, never mind a Christian.
So whose definition is the 'right' definition of what it means to be a Christian. Every sect has a different answer, they all think they are the right way.
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