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either way you look at it, if a human can do it using the S.M. the the universe may be able to do it. Oh wait, the universe did it already. My bad.
This exposes the silliness in the atheist idea that if we discover and repeat what God has done, we disprove God. Since whatever God has done was done using whatever laws and processes that exist, of course, we should be able eventually to replicate it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PanTerra
The universe has done a lot that we would eventually do. It does take time to learn. We are a way for the Cosmos to ponder itself.
Is your study published in a peer reviewed scientific journal?
That's the credibility difference between my study and your claims of a study on Big Foot.
Its been demonstrated in the scientific community that meditation produces what religious folks claim to be "religious" experiences. Same with mental discipline/ mind over matter techniques.
Which is why I said call it what you want. Some call it a religious experience some simply see it as the effects of deep meditation and mind control. *shrug*
And why would anyone claim it was religious when there's no basis to any religion except wishful thinking?
(It's actually easier to find evidence for God than miracles, because as Quora puts it, a miracle is by definition a non-repeatable event. Which, btw, the Big Bang and several scientific events fall under this category because they defy the normal framework)
Just wanted to comment on this.
What is "the normal framework" by which matter behaves when the entire universe is a singularity?
This can be by no means considered a miracle because we don't know what happens when the laws of physics breaks down.
Saying we don't know, therefore it was a miracle is profoundly unscientific.
Not to mention that without understanding why it works, we can say nothing about whether it's repeatable. I'd assume we wouldn't want to repeat it though
Consider the first person who started a fire? It's a miracle! It's unrepeatable... doesn't happen naturally...
Consider hurricanes, Tornadoes, etc. They are miracles and occur because God is angry, right?
As others have noted the articles linked in the OP are opinion pieces that are written by not only people who believe in a god but in the one god of Judeo Christian belief.
The one that said Hawking was wrong when he said there was no God may be right, I do not know the context that Hawking said that there was no God or if he even said it. But I am not educated enough to know how one would conduct a scientific study if a god exists. But until the OP links to actual scientific articles he is simply finding opinion pieces that agree with his view on religion or God.
My personal experience is there is neither a scientific nor a logical reason to declare that a God must exist in order for life or the universe to exist. I will not say that a god does not exist but I do not believe that one does but that is my opinion and I never expect there to be evidence to back up my claim. It is up to those who claim that there is proof of a god to provide that proof. There is not onus on those who say that they belief in a God to do so though. And if you claim that there is proof that your God exists then you have to show that this proof would not apply to any of the other gods.
The very first link in the OP stated that it was an opinion piece and that is what it was, nothing more and nothing less and there is nothing wrong with opinion pieces other than they are not science and should not be considered as science.
either way you look at it, if a human can do it using the S.M. the the universe may be able to do it. Oh wait, the universe did it already. My bad.
The solution to the whole thing, is to just go with Pedigree Pantheism.
GOD=ALL (The "Universe")
So....anything "done" is "done" by GOD. And IS GOD.
It is "The All God Show", all the time!
It is never NOT GOD. Nothing is separate from GOD. Not humans, not "methods", or concepts, or thoughts about concepts & methods.
If it IS...it is GOD.
The best thing about the GOD=ALL idea...is that it settles everything. The true, correct, and right answer is always, "GOD".
Finally...something that squares it all away...with no confusion. Even disagreement with it would still be "something"...and thus, "GOD"!
My personal experience is there is neither a scientific nor a logical reason to declare that a God must exist in order for life or the universe to exist. I will not say that a god does not exist but I do not believe that one does but that is my opinion and I never expect there to be evidence to back up my claim. It is up to those who claim that there is proof of a god to provide that proof. There is not onus on those who say that they belief in a God to do so though. And if you claim that there is proof that your God exists then you have to show that this proof would not apply to any of the other gods.
The argument often trotted out by theists is usually akin to "god is self-evident, look around" or "you aren't sincerely looking", or some variant of those.
If either of those statements were reasonable....then it would be as self-evident as the chair I'm sitting on. It is evidently here because I'm sitting on it. And I can even observe it has arms. And I didn't even need to sincerely look for it....it was right there. So I engaged with it.
The argument often trotted out by theists is usually akin to "god is self-evident, look around" or "you aren't sincerely looking", or some variant of those.
If either of those statements were reasonable....then it would be as self-evident as the chair I'm sitting on. It is evidently here because I'm sitting on it. And I can even observe it has arms. And I didn't even need to sincerely look for it....it was right there. So I engaged with it.
Of course it is self evident that God created the universe, the best proof of that is that he made Coyote the Trickster. Oh wait that is not proof of god as that is the wrong god, you need to look at it as proof of my own god. Or something like that. The universe is of course proof of the universe unless one thinks that it could be just in our own minds but I know my mind is not big enough to create that idea.
Of course it is self evident that God created the universe, the best proof of that is that he made Coyote the Trickster. Oh wait that is not proof of god as that is the wrong god, you need to look at it as proof of my own god. Or something like that. The universe is of course proof of the universe unless one thinks that it could be just in our own minds but I know my mind is not big enough to create that idea.
Maybe you created the universe and all of us unconsciously and have deluded yourself into forgetting you are actually god.
Try asking a religious person who is a wishful thinker or indoctrinated follower.
I am none of the above.
It was musing anyway, we'll never get a good answer.
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