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BoP has nothing to do with beliefs, not yours nor anyone else's. You just insist that your beliefs must be the default which is just arrogance. It seems to be an atheist disease.
Whaaaa???? Are you suggesting that atheist alone insist that they have all the answers? What was the give away? Was it the phrase "we can't yet know?" Someone's been spanking their monkey..intellectually speaking of course."
Although polis is the word for city, the most important usage of the term in ancient Greece meant body of citizens.
In that light all the gospel writer is saying is that they went and dwelt with the citizens of Nazareth.
What is a Polis? Polis is a term that is used to describe a tight-knit, small community of ancient Greek citizens who agreed on certain rules and customs. Usually a polis was centered on a small town and the countryside that surrounded it. The ancient Greek poleis (the plural of polis) are among the first recorded democratic governments in the world.
The polis centred on one town, usually walled, but included the surrounding countryside. The town contained a citadel on raised ground (acropolis) and a marketplace (agora). Government was centred in the town, but citizens of the polis lived throughout its territory. Ideally, the polis was a corporation of citizens who all participated in its government, religious cults, defense, and economic welfare and who obeyed its sacred and customary laws.
I think you and I have some understanding and respect, while we both probably have our biases. I look to you to point up mine for me. And I'll try to 'correct' for those.
I agree Trans. I mentioned before I like the way you look at things, which is that you will go where the evidence leads. That is why you surprised me by holding fast to the understanding Nazareth did not exist in the time of Jesus when the archeological evidence say otherwise. I could understand you questioning it if you only had 1 archeologist's evidence to go by;however I gave you 2 and whopper gave you 1 that states they have evidence of Nazareth from 3bc to the present. In my way of thinking that is a lot of evidence to just sweep under the rug or try to explain away without any other evidence to counter it.
Trans you asked me to point out your bias if I noticed it, and it is here I believe you have your bias glasses on.
True, there is no reason why it shouldn't have existed. I never imagined that Bethlehem didn't in the 1st c. That places like Jericho, Capernaum , Bethlehem and Nazareth may have existed (or not) and Pilate, Caiaphas, James the Just (2) and Joseph of Arimathea may have existed (or not), and indeed a Jesus, Cephas, James and Judas may have existed (or not) is no more the issue about gospel credibility that lists of discrepancies disproving the literal inerrant word of God is the issue with Bible reliability.
Trans what I highlighted is only for the fundamentalist. Myself and a few (more and more people are starting to see it) others here do not hold the bible as the literal inerrant word of God. That is why I do not disagree with much of what you have presented so far. Except I still think each author should stand or fall on their own instead of using one author against the other. It would be like taking the author of one who believes in eternal torment, one who believes in annihilation and a universalist and using the one to counter the other. Each belief holds to the common grounds of Jesus Christ as the central figure but each belief that comes from that same central figure is wide apart. In other words what I believe (i believe in the salvation of all men, even raf) does not stand or fall with eternal torment or annihilation.
But there may be some basic misconceptions, as happen too often with the Authorities. Too often they take it for granted that the Gospels are more or less a reliable record. That the Christiaity of the Apostles was, more or less, in line with Pauline Christianity and that the 'Nazareth' tradition ( and I reiterate that the OT never mentions the place and nor does Paul - for all I can see) and the error here perhaps is to assume that the Nazareth tradition necessarily means a decent- sized town.
Ok lets look at the OT does not mention Nazareth.
Archaeological research has revealed that a funerary and cult center at Kfar HaHoresh, about two miles (3.2 km) from current Nazareth, dates back roughly 9000 years to the Pre-Pottery Neolithic B era.[36] The remains of some 65 individuals were found, buried under huge horizontal headstone structures, some of which consisted of up to 3 tons of locally produced white plaster. Decorated human skulls uncovered there have led archaeologists to identify Kfar HaHoresh as a major cult centre in that era.[37]
In 1620 the Catholic Church purchased an area in the Nazareth basin measuring approximately 100 m × 150 m (328.08 ft × 492.13 ft) on the side of the hill known as the Nebi Sa'in. The Franciscan priest Bellarmino Bagatti, "Director of Christian Archaeology", carried out extensive excavation of this "Venerated Area" from 1955 to 1965. Fr. Bagatti uncovered pottery dating from the Middle Bronze Age (2200 to 1500 BC) and ceramics, silos and grinding mills from the Iron Age (1500 to 586 BC) which indicated substantial settlement in the Nazareth basin at that time. However, lack of archaeological evidence for Nazareth from Assyrian, Babylonian, Persian, Hellenistic or Early Roman times, at least in the major excavations between 1955 and 1990, shows that the settlement apparently came to an abrupt end about 720 BC, when the Assyrians destroyed many towns in the area.
So how come Nazareth at the time of Jesus is in question because the OT does not mention it but the dates above are not questioned even though the OT does not mention Nazareth.
The Gospels for the most part function as an elaborate deux ex machina. The story told in the Gospels had to tie Jesus to the old prophecies in order to bolster the claim that he was the Messiah. It didn't matter if any of the story was true as long as it worked to push their agenda and create market share for a fledgling religion.
The Gospels are more marketing pitch than historical document. They are as likely to be accurate as any of the things Hubbard wrote when creating Scientology.
You need to prove what you say, which you can't do, or be honest and admit you can't.
As was always the case with the late, great Eusebius, people could see that the evidence was presented, dismissed and reliance placed on denial and Faith.
Here the utter irreconcilability of the nativities, their unworkability individually, and the lack of support in other gospels and history, plus the signs of clumsy plot structure does for them, and dickering about Quirinus is simply piddling about. The only arguing point that possibly can be made, folks, is to argue for a census in the time of king Herod.
Every scrap of decent evidence is against that and nothing sound for it. The major point is that a census would (and did) provoke a revolt. Josephus couldn't have overlooked it. That Herod collected his taxes from commerce, that Quirinus is quite improbable for Herod's time, that you can't have a secret census that everyone knows to go and sign up for is just extra nails in the double coffin of what is couple of unfeasible stories. As demonstrated.
Eusebius' stubborn denial of everything was admirable, helpful and sometimes amusing. Now it's just a timewasting bore. I do not need a denialist to get me to make a case.
I know it's tempting to respond to goading, folks but trust me, it is a waste of time trying to reason with this bod. Anyone who can't tell reasoned argument on the evidence from timewasting needling -for -Jesus isn't going to get anything from a reasoned discussion anyway.
It is necessary to run away when you can' back up what you say. Asking for evidence is not goading. I'll even make it easy for you. Post one thing in the Bible that is not true.
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) does not stand or fall with eternal torment or annihilation.