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Old 03-04-2008, 04:42 AM
 
Location: Assisi, Italy
1,851 posts, read 3,812,126 times
Reputation: 353

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I think I am a deist, but I would like a clarification through discussion from you if you would be so kind.

I am told I am a Natural Law guy.

I do not believe the Virgin Mary immaculate conception story. Neither do I believe Jesus was physically resurrected. I do, however, believe that these people existed and live on through the church and have impacted the world greatly. I also believe that in spiritual sense, Jesus has been resurrected.

I respect those that believe as well a those that don't. A Franciscan monk came to bless my house last week and I welcomed him and thanked him.

I have never been Baptized. I don't go to church regularly. I am the "god father" of a person in the US. I was at her baptism when I was made her god father. I had dinner with a priest from the US and he asked how I could be a god father. I said in the US, priests can be homosexual too.

I have read about half the Bible. I visit loads of Churches and like understanding the Bible stories and religious art.

I have also read the Qur'an and Buddhist writings

I am sincere in my question and would welcome your discussion. Thanks.
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Old 03-04-2008, 05:34 AM
 
Location: Pikeville, Ky.
13,450 posts, read 21,104,497 times
Reputation: 17580
Bob, I don't think you are athiest..I think many, many people miss out on finding peace in their belief in God, because they worry too much about what label they need to attach to themselves to identify with the world..Before I finally found peace in my belief, I had to shed all the labels, rules and rituals that most of the world think you have to have in order to have a true relationship with God..I found that I was trying harder to fit the world view than I was trying to fit God..(I hope that makes sense)When asked about my religion, I just say that I am a believer.....
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Old 03-04-2008, 06:07 AM
 
Location: Mississippi
6,715 posts, read 11,991,500 times
Reputation: 4273
There's no real dichotomy that states those requirements. The only thing that really defines an atheist, as far as I know, is a dis-belief in god(s).

Atheist - a person who denies or disbelieves the existence of a supreme being or beings. - Dictionary.com

I mean... that's really it. I really don't know how to clarify any further. Do you match the definition the dictionary gives? There's no organized, structured, focal point to say "You must adhere to this in order to be a true Atheist". I suppose you either fit the dictionary description or you don't... It just doesn't get any simpler than that...

Just my personal opinion based on what you said... I imagine you are not an atheist but perhaps a 'Christian-Agnostic'?? In other words, you're not sure if God exists or not but if one does than it must be the Christian God. Does that make sense?
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Old 03-04-2008, 06:12 AM
 
Location: Assisi, Italy
1,851 posts, read 3,812,126 times
Reputation: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by GCSTroop View Post
There's no real dichotomy that states those requirements. The only thing that really defines an atheist, as far as I know, is a dis-belief in god(s).

Atheist - a person who denies or disbelieves the existence of a supreme being or beings. - Dictionary.com

I mean... that's really it. I really don't know how to clarify any further. Do you match the definition the dictionary gives? There's no organized, structured, focal point to say "You must adhere to this in order to be a true Atheist". I suppose you either fit the dictionary description or you don't... It just doesn't get any simpler than that...

Just my personal opinion based on what you said... I imagine you are not an atheist but perhaps a 'Christian-Agnostic'?? In other words, you're not sure if God exists or not but if one does than it must be the Christian God. Does that make sense?
Is not the Christan God and Allah one in the same? I do believe in a higher power.
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Old 03-04-2008, 06:20 AM
 
Location: Mississippi
6,715 posts, read 11,991,500 times
Reputation: 4273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob The Builder View Post
Is not the Christan God and Allah one in the same? I do believe in a higher power.
That's a great question. Yes, from a scholarly standpoint they are one in the same. It is the God of Abraham (same as Jewish God as well). However, many Christians (and some Jews??) will vehemently deny that their God has anything to do with Allah. They are the same Gods but worshipped slightly differently and with different names and so somehow, in some people's eyes, that makes them different.

Think about it like this:

In Greek Mythology you had Ares (the God of War).

In Roman Mythology you had Mars (also the God of War).

The similarities between the two were/are astonishing. They had different names but they were rooted from the same belief system. I must note that the Romans held Mars in much better regard than the Greeks held Ares.
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Old 03-04-2008, 06:34 AM
 
Location: DC Area, for now
3,517 posts, read 11,750,194 times
Reputation: 2129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob The Builder View Post
Is not the Christan God and Allah one in the same? I do believe in a higher power.
Your last statement disqualifies you as an atheist. All the rest of your story is irrelevant to the question. It is as simple as that.

As for what you are, that remains to be discussed, but from what you said, Deist could well fit.

The 1st sentence is also simple despite all the protestations to the contrary. Judasim, Christianity, and Muslims all share the same god of the Torah, invented or documented and codified some 2600 years ago by Persian priests who were directed to cement Cyrus the Great's hold over Palestine with the writing of the Torah. Any claims to the contrary are based in ignorance of their own history. These are facts.
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Old 03-04-2008, 06:35 AM
 
Location: Assisi, Italy
1,851 posts, read 3,812,126 times
Reputation: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue62 View Post
Bob, I don't think you are athiest..I think many, many people miss out on finding peace in their belief in God, because they worry too much about what label they need to attach to themselves to identify with the world..Before I finally found peace in my belief, I had to shed all the labels, rules and rituals that most of the world think you have to have in order to have a true relationship with God..I found that I was trying harder to fit the world view than I was trying to fit God..(I hope that makes sense)When asked about my religion, I just say that I am a believer.....
I suppose an atheist would not even ask such a question. I do find comfort in a relationship with my higher power.
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Old 03-04-2008, 06:40 AM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 10,260,788 times
Reputation: 1423
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob The Builder View Post
I suppose an atheist would not even ask such a question. I do find comfort in a relationship with my higher power.

That's the idea behind every religion, to build a relationship with that higher power, it can be a father/son relationship, mother/son relationship, a friendship, a master/servant relationship, or all of the above

what matters the most is that you get close to that higher power and feel his love and pressence every moment of your life.

Your body is a temple of God, you don't need to seek him externally because that higher power is found and resides within you.

Blessings!!
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Old 03-04-2008, 06:45 AM
 
Location: Assisi, Italy
1,851 posts, read 3,812,126 times
Reputation: 353
I was just reading about Padre Pio being exhumed and remember hearing all these claims about his stigmata. I was told that you could see through his hand where the stigmata was. I thought wait, is there a picture so I can see it? I am surrounded by many expats over here who seem to believe in some very far fetched stories. Angels bringing the House of Mary to Loreto? I believe people brought it over and they were considered angels.

Are these people seeking God externally?

If I don't believe these stories, does that mean I have no faith? Is "faith" a belief in God or do I have to buy he whole loaf?
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Old 03-04-2008, 06:58 AM
 
Location: Pikeville, Ky.
13,450 posts, read 21,104,497 times
Reputation: 17580
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob The Builder View Post
I was just reading about Padre Pio being exhumed and remember hearing all these claims about his stigmata. I was told that you could see through his hand where the stigmata was. I thought wait, is there a picture so I can see it? I am surrounded by many expats over here who seem to believe in some very far fetched stories. Angels bringing the House of Mary to Loreto? I believe people brought it over and they were considered angels.

Are these people seeking God externally?

If I don't believe these stories, does that mean I have no faith? Is "faith" a belief in God or do I have to buy he whole loaf?
IMO, Bob, if you don't believe those stories, it has nothing to do with your "faith"..I also believe that many of these "miracles" can be answered through scientific research and explanations
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