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Than again I'm not sure what Bathsheba believed, she might have influenced a believe in immaterial psyches (if David had one and didn't believe only in resurrection: the baby would resurrect first?).
The Priest Caste that Yahweh designed most often took the "ashes to ashes" thing very literally, and saw the "breath of God" as not sentient but powerful enough to bring a body to sentience (literally by breathing?).
For #1, I think that the ancient Jews believed in Souls, Spirits, and Bodies, not just a homogenous fusion of soul and body. I also expect that based on Psalm 16 where it says the holy one wouldn't see the pit/experience decay, and guess that based on Egyptian burial practices of embalming, that the Israelites like David had a belief in a future resurrection. In the verse you referred to, according to what you said, it doesn't specify that the baby would rise first, only that David was going to the baby. So theoretically the baby and David could rise at one and the same moment.
For #2, I think that the Israelite priests did have a sense that the breath of God was sentient. This is because the same word for breath is spirit like you said, and in Genesis 1 we see the breath/spirit of God hovering over the waters "like a dove". Later, in Proverbs and the apocryphal Wisdom of Solomon, "Wisdom" is called a spirit and is described as if "she" were a being. It does say in Genesis 1 that God "breathed" life into Adam. And thus it seems to present a literal concept of "breathing" life into Adam. The word "expiring", as referring to a person's dying, literally means exhaling, breathing out, breathing one's last. The same etymology exists in Hebrew when a person "expires".
Ezekiel changed the laws, the sacrifices, and the Holy days where Jesus came to fulfill these things. Yom Kippur moved to Nisan 14, the feast of Tabernacles bull killed on Nisan 14, the ram of Pentecost killed on Nisan 14, the red heifer killed on Nisan 14, the Passover lamb killed on Nisan 14.
We make the bold claim that Jesus was all the sacrifices but if this is true, it means you have to make all the holy days happen on one single day and this is what Ezekiel showed, that all the sacrifices would happen on Nisan 14 as Jesus died on Nisan 14 as all those sacrifices, not just a lamb, a ram, a bull, a goat, and a red heifer that is without the city, a sacrifice no man may eat of.
Thank you for sharing.
May I please ask if Ezekiel ever wrote that the sacrifices in bold would be performed on a single day?
Thank you.
Thank you for sharing. I welcome you to describe your own experience in more depth.
What my concern is regarding this kind of phenomena is how reliable and realistic it is, as opposed to being imaginary or made up. The problem is that sometimes people daydream or have mental illness where they are delusional or hallucinate. Anyway, discernment is also an important part of Christianity. So how can one discern what you experienced from daydreaming, delusions, and hallucinations?
Regards.
for me everything I know that I know is from him is double( or more ) witnessed.
so a dream will be confirmed by someone else , his word , a new song .. to me I picture His kingdom is always like a court of law . it isn't "real" unless it is witnessed or double witnessed, it has no weight or value until it is double witnessed. it will not happen until it has been witnessed and then proclaimed/announced . so are you to be a witness ? ,the double witness? or the proclaimer , these are always the question once you think you got something from the Lord. if it was just for you the witnesses will not come in a public way .
so that is why Lana saying she saw Fire in the belly or
the roses burning was a first second or even third witness to thing I had seen or experienced but was not sure how to or when to express a thing.
The kingdom is like a court of law always.
we wait for the lawyer to call us to the stand or hand us a trumpet or bull horn..
if it is not witnessed from outside of you .. or it has not become it own double or triple witness( was true once , is being true , will be true ) then leave it on the shelf you put all things you don't understand ... Yet. and we all have that shelf, if not tons of those shelves.
Thank you for sharing.
May I please ask if Ezekiel ever wrote that the sacrifices in bold would be performed on a single day?
Thank you.
Ezekiel 45 ~ showing all the Holy days moved to Nisan 14
First coming of Jesus on Nisan 14 showing the Yom Kippur Goat, the ram of Shavuot, and the Sukkot bull, and there has never been a bull sacrificed on Nisan 14 in all of the history of Israel unless we say Jesus was all the sacrifices on Nisan 14.
21In the first month, in the fourteenth day of the month, ye shall have the passover, a feast of seven days; unleavened bread shall be eaten. 22And upon that day shall the prince prepare for himself and for all the people of the land a bullock for a sin offering. 23And seven days of the feast he shall prepare a burnt offering to the LORD, seven bullocks and seven rams without blemish daily the seven days; and a kid of the goats daily for a sin offering. 24And he shall prepare a meat offering of an ephah for a , and an ephah for a ram, and an hin of oil for an ephah.
The second coming of Jesus on Tishri 15~~ Happens in you.
25In the seventh month, in the fifteenth day of the month, shall he do the like in the feast of the seven days, according to the sin offering, according to the burnt offering, and according to the meat offering, and according to the oil.
What happened with Jesus being all the sacrifices on Nisan 14 is appointed to happen again on Tishri 15.
The first coming in the spring, and the second coming in the fall.
That water issued out from the Temple and Jesus came making fishers of men to stand on the banks catching all sorts of creatures.
Ezekiel 47 ~ fishers of men to save people from the waters.
10And it shall come to pass, that the fishers shall stand upon it from Engedi even unto Eneglaim; they shall be a place to spread forth nets; their fish shall be according to their kinds, as the fish of the great sea, exceeding many.
This is what I learned from having a Jewish study bible, it is the JPS that explains how evident it is that Yom Kippur, Sukkot and Shavuot sacrifices will all take place on Nisan 14, in it's notes beside scripture.
A great deal has changed in Ezekiel concerning temple design and laws and just how you are appointed to speak to the prince of Ezekiel's temple.
The eastern gate is opened on Sabbaths and new moons for the prince to enter, in order to present HIS offerings on these appointed visitation days, and this is why it is so extremely important for a person to walk in his spring season and then his fall season if he is able. The days are appointed JUST FOR YOU, that it is appointed for the Prince himself to come bringing his gifts and his offerings for his temple, the temple you are.
The prince shall attend at the gate posts himself and he bows down, and the people who have come seeking the prince at the gate bow down to the prince in the same gate entrance.
The people shall no longer enter by the East gate, but they shall come in the North and exit out the south and they shall come from the south and exit the north.
This is not talking about some building that a man built, it is literally explaining YOU and how you interact with the prince in his new moons and his Sabbaths.
This is not instruction on what takes place at the temple in Jerusalem, it takes place inside you and it is absolutely not like Solomon's or Herod's temple.
There is so many people in this expanding temple that crowd management had to come in play with the new entrances to the temple.
The coming of the Lord is as the lightning begins in the east and it's brilliance is so bright that it is seen all the way into the west.{This has a bit to do with Ezekiel's temple}
This means that the coming of the Lord comes to the inner man in the east, and it's coming is so brilliant that it's light and glory will be seen all the way in the west, in the outer man. It is saying that people will glow and shine at the coming of the Lord at Sukkot.
The rain of Sukkot that we pray for is not rain, and the seed that needs the rain is not a literal seed, it is a seed that is planted in you for the hopes that you receive the rain to fall on that seed so the seed will die because unless a seed dies, it cannot bear fruit.
Zechariah 14 is a seriously scary thing when it threatens people saying,'' You shall have no rain.''
If you don't receive the rain of Sukkot, it means you will not receive the double portion of spirit promised on Sukkot to make you a freaking immortal.
But woe are those who fight against Jerusalem, Their eyes shall melt in their heads and their tongues shall turn into ashes before they even fall.
Last edited by Hannibal Flavius; 03-26-2017 at 07:53 PM..
Thank you for sharing. I welcome you to describe your own experience in more depth.
What my concern is regarding this kind of phenomena is how reliable and realistic it is, as opposed to being imaginary or made up. The problem is that sometimes people daydream or have mental illness where they are delusional or hallucinate. Anyway, discernment is also an important part of Christianity. So how can one discern what you experienced from daydreaming, delusions, and hallucinations?
Regards.
YOU couldn't discern what happened to me, because it happened to me and was for my personal edification and teaching about a section of the Word, UNLESS He gave you the same thing in that, or in some other way (spiritually), EXCEPT in whether or not it lines up with the written Word. What He did with me this particular time I'm talking about (there have been others) was to WITNESS to ME that what John the Revelator saw was true and HOW he was allowed to perceive it, since his testimony was that he was in the SPIRIT on the Lord's day, and that this generation is the one that it is speaking to, as it's a PERSONAL Word.
So for me it was a witness that His Word is true, His Spirit is capable of catching us up in the Spirit to see what the Spirit wants us to see. All I can tell you is, if it ever happens to you, no one will be able to tell you it didn't happen, and more importantly, that it wasn't G-d's Spirit that didn't accomplish it. I was in prayer with 2 others when this particular one occurred.
The Spirit's job in part, is to witness what has already been written by that selfsame Spirit (and refute anything written by another spirit). He can do it in a myriad of ways. It is then, spirit to Spirit communication, bypassing the carnal mind which is His enemy, at best a servant. This is one of the main reasons why we are given His Spirit in the first place, as the Comforter and Teacher, the purpose of the Holy Ghost. Men twist things to suit their fleshly motives, and evil spirits to suit theirs, but the Spirit that wrote the books twists nothing, but instead witnesses all, so that we need not take any man's word for it, that it IS the spoken and recorded Word of G-d. Peace
Actually, the astral projection you mention, is the counterfeit of what I described. Peace
[I was confused with what you were trying to say there for a moment.] Oh, so you mean that your astral projection is real and the ones you don't wish are real simply aren't real because you don't think they are... Well, you might explain a little more and clear some things up. Welcome any time, I'd like to hear some possibilities for evidence of such a personally conclusive belief that you might offer. I happen to think that all astral projection experiences are mental, and the whole of you stays right where you are. You can easily test my idea, but only with people who propose to be able to do it at will or predictably (the rest would be hard to test to any good standard).
[edited in from here on]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rbbi1
YOU couldn't discern what happened to me, because it happened to me and was for my personal edification and teaching about a section of the Word, UNLESS He gave you the same thing in that, or in some other way (spiritually), EXCEPT in whether or not it lines up with the written Word. What He did with me this particular time I'm talking about (there have been others) was to WITNESS to ME that what John the Revelator saw was true and HOW he was allowed to perceive it, since his testimony was that he was in the SPIRIT on the Lord's day, and that this generation is the one that it is speaking to, as it's a PERSONAL Word.
So for me it was a witness that His Word is true, His Spirit is capable of catching us up in the Spirit to see what the Spirit wants us to see. All I can tell you is, if it ever happens to you, no one will be able to tell you it didn't happen, and more importantly, that it wasn't G-d's Spirit that didn't accomplish it. I was in prayer with 2 others when this particular one occurred.
The Spirit's job in part, is to witness what has already been written by that selfsame Spirit (and refute anything written by another spirit). He can do it in a myriad of ways. It is then, spirit to Spirit communication, bypassing the carnal mind which is His enemy, at best a servant. This is one of the main reasons why we are given His Spirit in the first place, as the Comforter and Teacher, the purpose of the Holy Ghost. Men twist things to suit their fleshly motives, and evil spirits to suit theirs, but the Spirit that wrote the books twists nothing, but instead witnesses all, so that we need not take any man's word for it, that it IS the spoken and recorded Word of G-d. Peace
Oh I see... it seems purely psychological to me. With such a standard as your, we wouldn't even be able to tell the madmen that they are delusional. An individual with an improper brain-induced astral-projection experience could then just say "it was my experience, therefore it is true." It seems to me that you were cultured into and meditated (prayed) on how to hypnotize yourselves with your divination tools and peer-pressure practices used in Bibliolatrous rituals.
Dear Luminous Truth,
You asked two questions:
For #1, I think that the ancient Jews believed in Souls, Spirits, and Bodies, not just a homogenous fusion of soul and body. I also expect that based on Psalm 16 where it says the holy one wouldn't see the pit/experience decay, and guess that based on Egyptian burial practices of embalming, that the Israelites like David had a belief in a future resurrection. In the verse you referred to, according to what you said, it doesn't specify that the baby would rise first, only that David was going to the baby. So theoretically the baby and David could rise at one and the same moment.
For #2, I think that the Israelite priests did have a sense that the breath of God was sentient. This is because the same word for breath is spirit like you said, and in Genesis 1 we see the breath/spirit of God hovering over the waters "like a dove". Later, in Proverbs and the apocryphal Wisdom of Solomon, "Wisdom" is called a spirit and is described as if "she" were a being. It does say in Genesis 1 that God "breathed" life into Adam. And thus it seems to present a literal concept of "breathing" life into Adam. The word "expiring", as referring to a person's dying, literally means exhaling, breathing out, breathing one's last. The same etymology exists in Hebrew when a person "expires".
Souls, Spirits, and Bodies? or souls/spirits and bodies? I ask only because I've seen Christian denominations that believe that Souls and Spirits are not the same thing and in fact humans are composed of souls (minds?), spirits (pure selves/breath of god), and bodies (material selves). The ancient Egyptians came as far as supposing/proposing that a person's whole identity is truly composed of 5 or more aspects (mental-self, life-force, pure-self, guilty-self, etc). They, of course, along with the Babylonians and Persians, were right next to the strategically located kingdoms of Judah and Israel. What I had heard about the ancient Jews that relied (believed only in the Torah (Pentateuch) as being legitimately written and true) is that animals were described as "souls" as well, so "soul" might have simply meant "being." This is from people who don't think animals are saved into paradise nor resurrected.
[I was confused with what you were trying to say there for a moment.] Oh, so you mean that your astral projection is real and the ones you don't wish are real simply aren't real because you don't think they are... Well, you might explain a little more and clear some things up. Welcome any time, I'd like to hear some possibilities for evidence of such a personally conclusive belief that you might offer. I happen to think that all astral projection experiences are mental, and the whole of you stays right where you are. You can easily test my idea, but only with people who propose to be able to do it at will or predictably (the rest would be hard to test to any good standard).
[edited in from here on]
Oh I see... it seems purely psychological to me. With such a standard as your, we wouldn't even be able to tell the madmen that they are delusional. An individual with an improper brain-induced astral-projection experience could then just say "it was my experience, therefore it is true." It seems to me that you were cultured into and meditated (prayed) on how to hypnotize yourselves with your divination tools and peer-pressure practices used in Bibliolatrous rituals.
Of course it would seem that way to you. You have to have THE Spirit before you can experience what He does. Sort of like you have a car but having never known gas or what it was for, you can't really get a clear idea or EXPERIENCE what the car is capable of without the gas empowering it. Without gas in it, it's little better than a large planter or a nice big doorstop.
The "cultured into" part is a hoot. I was an agnostic Jew, so no I didn't hypnotize myself with any "divination tools", and certainly peer pressure had NADA to do with it.
Since you think astral projection is all mental, it wouldn't mean anything for me to explain that, or the difference in the two, either, so I'll pass. Peace
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