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Old 01-13-2018, 08:13 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
... God can forgive us any time He wants. He needs nothing....
Including the imaginary baseball player. As you point out, then He doesn't need the fanciful baseball player either.

Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 01-13-2018 at 08:48 PM..
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Old 01-13-2018, 08:27 PM
 
12,005 posts, read 12,709,307 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
The moral bankruptcy of EVERY religion....
MPD, that does not sound intelligent or rational. What would we think if someone posted this:

"The moral bankruptcy of ALL atheism"
or
"The moral bankruptcy of ALL science research"
or
"The moral bankruptcy of EVERY university"
Or
"The moral bankruptcy of ALL academia"

That's the face you present to the world.
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Old 01-13-2018, 08:39 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
The moral bankruptcy of EVERY religion is ...
So what you are saying then is Buddhism and Christianity are morally bankrupt. And yet you refer to Buddhist teachings, and you yourself identify as a Christian. You yourself belong to the religion Christianity. You express loathing and contempt for something you yourself are part of.
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Old 01-13-2018, 09:03 PM
 
689 posts, read 191,617 times
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Yea... I'm also not in the 'G-d is going to confirm us murdering christ gets us his forgiveness' camp....

G-d's forgiven us before and after we crucified Christ, because we have been guilty of the same thing before and after Christ, selfish Unholy evil disguised as good thru pride.

I do believe we are all guilty of crucifying christ, if we were there we would not have defended him or sympathized with him, it's a truth and lesson of the human condition that lasts as long as we do and exactly what we need forgiveness from and a working in us by G-d to remove.

The Holy Spirit in mercy makes this possible and it is the evidence of Grace.

If that makes sense, pride is evidence that some one is not forgiven, once sin is encapsulated in pride it breeds death.
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Old 01-13-2018, 10:55 PM
 
36,399 posts, read 24,450,955 times
Reputation: 5763
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
I encountered a consciousness that establishes our entire reality. A conscious reality is about as real a God as one can imagine. But I will cede that you are unfamiliar enough with my Synthesis that it probably seems unsupported by the science you know. The idea that one of us had to achieve what the rest of us could not achieve makes far more sense to me than one of us had to be scourged and crucified as a blood sacrifice to appease God for ANYTHING so He could forgive us! God can forgive us any time He wants. He needs nothing. But again, I will cede that you are unfamiliar enough with my Synthesis that it probably seems unsupported by the science you know. I imagine that a human being was born 2000 odd years ago who achieved perfect resonance ("Identity" in science) with the Spirit of God in His human consciousness. His death resulted in His human Spirit being reborn as Spirit and connected ALL human consciousness with God's consciousness. I agree, Tzaph, that is why I refer to these aspects of my otherwise scientifically supported Synthesis as my BELIEFS.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel View Post
If you wish for others to consider your fanciful magical imaginings as "beliefs" then recognize and acknowledge that other people have beliefs as well.
Not "fanciful descriptions" they "imagine to be true" because it "pleases them."
You presume that there is no way to evaluate beliefs reasonably. That pretends that a Flying Spaghetti Monster is as believable as a God who IS love. I hope you do not accept that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel View Post
Including the imaginary baseball player. As you point out, then He doesn't need the fanciful baseball player either.
I said God needs NOTHING to forgive us. The designated hitter was someone WE NEEDED to do what we could NOT. It had nothing to do with getting God to forgive us. It eliminated any NEED to forgive the rest of us for missing the mark because He HIT the mark.
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Old 01-14-2018, 04:43 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
You presume that there is no way to evaluate beliefs reasonably. That pretends that a Flying Spaghetti Monster is as believable as a God who IS love. I hope you do not accept that.....
Previously you said god is nature, which includes tsunamis floods tornados and hurricanes. Those kill a lot of people and cause a lot of damage. And when asked you could not explain the difference between God and nature. That is not reasonable or rational.

Then you said god is everything. Well then that includes all manner of evil and dastardly deeds and suffering. And atheism too. Now you say God is love. So you are saying evil and suffering and atheism and tornados and hurricanes are love.

Following your logic and using your definitions.
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Old 01-14-2018, 06:22 AM
 
10,028 posts, read 3,839,600 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel View Post
Previously you said god is nature, which includes tsunamis floods tornados and hurricanes. Those kill a lot of people and cause a lot of damage. And when asked you could not explain the difference between God and nature. That is not reasonable or rational.

Then you said god is everything. Well then that includes all manner of evil and dastardly deeds and suffering. And atheism too. Now you say God is love. So you are saying evil and suffering and atheism and tornados and hurricanes are love.

Following your logic and using your definitions.
Not being able to explain the difference between god and nature is very rational.

let me ask you this, what the difference between you and the process that take place in the volume we identify as you?

nature's interactions are what "causes" the living planet. Then, the living planet acts as the living planet does. The hydrosphere, a system in the planets "life" then acts like the hydrosphere does. there is are large waves that kill people.

we then can scale that notion down to you. What do bacteria in you think when white blood cells attack and kill them? What does a new heart think when your body attacks and kills it? is "your living" being evil by killing the new heart?

Ita the human that describes tragedy ans "bad". to the universe its just an unfortunate by product of life.
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Old 01-14-2018, 06:28 AM
 
10,028 posts, read 3,839,600 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel View Post
MPD, that does not sound intelligent or rational. What would we think if someone posted this:

"The moral bankruptcy of ALL atheism"
or
"The moral bankruptcy of ALL science research"
or
"The moral bankruptcy of EVERY university"
Or
"The moral bankruptcy of ALL academia"

That's the face you present to the world.
Yes, I use this one myself trap.

Following the scientific method I searched for personality types that were a direct result of religion. I couldn't find one. I found that personality traits defined the expression of religion.

Bad people = bad religious expression
good people = good expression of religion.

Its one of my top 5 reasons for not being anti-religious.

In fact, If I assumed it was religion, then anti-religious socialism is far more dangerous freedom than any other religion I know.
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Old 01-14-2018, 06:28 AM
 
12,005 posts, read 12,709,307 times
Reputation: 8460
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arach Angle View Post
Not being able to explain the difference between god and nature is very rational.

let me ask you this, what the difference between you and the process that take place in the volume we identify as you?

nature's interactions are what "causes" the living planet. Then, the living planet acts as the living planet does. The hydrosphere, a system in the planets "life" then acts like the hydrosphere does. there is are large waves that kill people.

we then can scale that notion down to you. What do bacteria in you think when white blood cells attack and kill them? What does a new heart think when your body attacks and kills it? is "your living" being evil by killing the new heart?

Ita the human that describes tragedy ans "bad". to the universe its just an unfortunate by product of life.
That does not explain the diffefence between God and nature. It does not address God at all. And the question is for mystic in this instance to see if he can differentiate between God and nature. Thus far he has not been able to.

You arach can provide a definition for "omni dude" though. We like to have terms defined and it appears that one is yours
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Old 01-14-2018, 06:34 AM
 
10,028 posts, read 3,839,600 times
Reputation: 1142
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
I encountered a consciousness that establishes our entire reality. A conscious reality is about as real a God as one can imagine. But I will cede that you are unfamiliar enough with my Synthesis that it probably seems unsupported by the science you know. The idea that one of us had to achieve what the rest of us could not achieve makes far more sense to me than one of us had to be scourged and crucified as a blood sacrifice to appease God for ANYTHING so He could forgive us! God can forgive us any time He wants. He needs nothing. But again, I will cede that you are unfamiliar enough with my Synthesis that it probably seems unsupported by the science you know. I imagine that a human being was born 2000 odd years ago who achieved perfect resonance ("Identity" in science) with the Spirit of God in His human consciousness. His death resulted in His human Spirit being reborn as Spirit and connected ALL human consciousness with God's consciousness. I agree, Tzaph, that is why I refer to these aspects of my otherwise scientifically supported Synthesis as my BELIEFS.
maybe, with the reduced brain functioning starting to rebound from depression it seemed to you like you met something when in fact, one area of you brain become connected to the rest of your body. That event would seem both infinite and mystical.

And I say you may have met the living planet. That would seem infinite.

either way. both of my suggestions offer explanation, mechanism, and predictions.

Yours offers "I concede it has no support."

which is more valid?
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