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Your preference for demagoguery is noted. The baseball analogy is in no way intended to be a literal description but you knew that. Sad to be so entrapped in tradition and denial.
you missed the point.
the point is you take a literal human person who died over 2,000 years ago and elevate that human person to the stature of God. Literally.
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel i agree. that's the problem with elevating a human baseball player to the stature of God. again, your logic applied to your own views.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
There is tremendous danger in elevating mere flawed and fallible humans to the stature of God. No good can come of it, period!
You claim that a dead Jew is God. And at the same time you recognize the "tremendous danger in elevating mere flawed and fallible humans to the stature of God. No good can come of it." I agree. Your statements, your logic applied to your own views.
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 02-12-2018 at 01:53 PM..
And yet you apply "literal description" quite freely to many parts of the bible in your scathing opening post. so....double standard.
I only apply it to those who DO literally interpret those ideas. As regards the baseball analogy, you know full well that I do NOT. You could make some sincere effort NOT to be coy or disingenuous in these discussions, Tzaph.
You claim that a dead Jew is God. And at the same time you recognize the "tremendous danger in elevating mere flawed and fallible humans to the stature of God. No good can come of it." I agree. Your statements, your logic applied to your own views.
To be accurate, I claim that a "dead Jew" (your words) embodied the Holy Spirit of God within His human consciousness elevating ALL human consciousness with God and was born again as Spirit to abide with us as the Comforter sent in His name to guide us to the Truth God has "written in our hearts." That is not at all what you inferred from my posts.
To be accurate, I claim that a "dead Jew" (your words) embodied the Holy Spirit of God within His human consciousness elevating ALL human consciousness with God and was born again as Spirit to abide with us as the Comforter sent in His name to guide us to the Truth God has "written in our hearts." That is not at all what you inferred from my posts.
you said in another post that in your religion the dead Jew you pray to is the same as God.
that is elevating a human to the stature of God.
that is elevating (your words here) "a mere flawed and fallible human to the stature of God."
every human is flawed and fallible, by definition, that is part and parcel of being human. including the dead Jew.
your posts are clear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
There is tremendous danger in elevating mere flawed and fallible humans to the stature of God. No good can come of it, period!...
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
.... Pragmatically, there is no significant difference between worshiping Jesus as the representation of God and worshiping God. ....
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 02-12-2018 at 05:01 PM..
I only apply it to those who DO literally interpret those ideas. As regards the baseball analogy, you know full well that I do NOT. You could make some sincere effort NOT to be coy or disingenuous in these discussions, Tzaph.
I guess you can't or won't make the effort given your post below.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel
you said in another post that in your religion the dead Jew you pray to is the same as God.
that is elevating a human to the stature of God.
that is elevating (your words here) "a mere flawed and fallible human to the stature of God."
every human is flawed and fallible, by definition, that is part and parcel of being human. including the dead Jew.
your posts are clear.
Clearly, you refuse to deal honestly and objectively with my views because of your extreme defensiveness about your own views. The human consciousness of Jesus achieved perfect resonance (Identity) with the consciousness of God. That means His consciousness is indistinguishable from God's. Upon His death, His human consciousness became the first-born Spirit offspring of God. We are to follow Him as the adopted Spirit offspring of God upon our death. Your need to classify Him as God or not is a distraction and a distinction that has no relevance.
We are just conditioned to think of ourselves as a physical being by the necessities of living in a material world.
I have never experienced conditioning. Fact is we are a physical being existing in a physical world.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
We are a Spirit being that is nurtured and developed within a physical body and brain. We will leave it upon our physical death and be "born again" as Spirit in a spiritual body. IMO.
I guess you can't or won't make the effort given your post below.
Clearly, you refuse to deal honestly and objectively with my views because of your extreme defensiveness about your own views. The human consciousness of Jesus achieved perfect resonance (Identity) with the consciousness of God. That means His consciousness is indistinguishable from God's. Upon His death, His human consciousness became the first-born Spirit offspring of God. We are to follow Him as the adopted Spirit offspring of God upon our death. Your need to classify Him as God or not is a distraction and a distinction that has no relevance.
It is very relevant. Because you say it is "tremendous danger" and "no good can come of it" to elevate a human to the stature of God, a "mere flawed and fallible human." But then you do it anyway. You have made a dead Jew in your own words "indistinguishable from God." You can't distinguish between a dead Jew and God.
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 02-13-2018 at 06:04 AM..
It is very relevant. Because you say it is "tremendous danger" and "no good can come of it" to elevate a human to the stature of God, a "mere flawed and fallible human." But then you do it anyway. You have made a dead Jew in your own words "indistinguishable from God." You can't distinguish between a dead Jew and God.
The danger is real. The answer is not to refrain from doing it but to be aware of the danger. People drive every day and they are mostly careful. The danger in claiming the Spirit guidance, just as in elevating a living human. is in doing so WITHOUT reference to the nature of that Spirit. People do it allthe time and some religious traditions clim that guidance for their institution, but you will rarely see those people or institutions justifying their claims by showi ng how they demonstrate the Spirit described by Jesus.
The virus is responsible for allowing our nerves and brain cells to function. This would be the case for a complex brain like ours, or a simple brain used only for regulation.
To get to consciousness we had to first evolve a complex mid brain, and then the intellectual fore brain. So it's just part of the evolutionary chain, it's not the direct cause of our consciousness. And that's what the title implied.
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