Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Referencing this analogy, does your God not provide some guidelines as to how to make this climb? I'm aware of the Christian God's requirements per Jesus, "No one comes to the father but by me". Is this type of "way" not mandated by your religion?
Once they are used, it can be determined if that which is arrived at, and the journey itself, are distinctly possessed or shared.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant
What a skeptic trusts is evidence and/or logical argument. It is the only thing TO trust. Religion has ginned up religious faith as an alternative, which, stripped of the flowery descriptions, is nothing more than belief without a requirement of evidence, or, as even some theists have characterized it, a "blind leap". On its face this can't begin to compare to its polar opposite, data which comes from personal or human experience or can be inferred through reason. Because of these "optics", much of religious dogma elevates religious faith into a virtue rather than the vice that it is, and deplores "mere" reason as the vice that it isn't.
Literally millennia of operant conditioning have trained humanity in general to not see this dichotomy for what it is. Instead, religious faith is seen as the better epistemology despite that it has never expanded human knowledge, innovated or invented or corrected anything provided by scientific endeavor. Instead, religious faith is seen as, at minimum, the only available tool in the allegedly "non-overlapping magisteria" of science and religion, when it comes to things science doesn't presently and perhaps in some cases cannot inherently explain or even address. Rather than sit with that uncertainty, false certitudes are invented out of whole cloth.
Faith in God and its provisions contests materialism, whether the latter sits isolated or as an arsenal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRANSPONDER
Then if they all said the peak was different from what the others had reached
It could still be determined if they were at the same thing.
I went through that with a JW. Depending on whether you see medes and persians as two separate rulers (I think they have to be regarded as one from the point of view of the Jews of the time) that only gets us to the Seleucid rulers or Rome. since the history (cast as prophecy) matches up well to the Seleucid dealings with Ptolemaic Egypt and Judea, the 'feet of clay' can be regarded as the Seleucids. And my view is that Daniel was written as a Prophetic guarantee of victory for the Maccabean revolt.
Thus, it is long done and dusted and it is utterly absurd to relate it to the USA.
The reason people find it so easy to apply to modern events is because history repeats itself and human nature doesn't change.
Faith in God and its provisions contests materialism, whether the latter sits isolated or as an arsenal.
Only indirectly, and we should clarify that it contests philosophical materialism, not just the belief that financial gain is a primary goal in life -- which seems to be what a lot of theists think the term means when they say that.
What religious faith contests directly is reason. It does that by asserting without evidence that invisible beings and realms exist (the supernatural) and has primacy over the natural (material) world. And so yes indirectly it opposes the physical as "all there is". This is not, however, a virtue.
Only indirectly, and we should clarify that it contests philosophical materialism, not just the belief that financial gain is a primary goal in life -- which seems to be what a lot of theists think the term means when they say that.
What religious faith contests directly is reason. It does that by asserting without evidence that invisible beings and realms exist (the supernatural) and has primacy over the natural (material) world. And so yes indirectly it opposes the physical as "all there is". This is not, however, a virtue.
and when they are shown to be there, at least the claim being more valid than not, ... some just deny at all cost. Deny anything that counters a statement of belief.
yeah youre so much more logical. fundy think never goes away, its a personality thing not a belief thing.
I went through that with a JW. Depending on whether you see medes and persians as two separate rulers (I think they have to be regarded as one from the point of view of the Jews of the time) that only gets us to the Seleucid rulers or Rome. since the history (cast as prophecy) matches up well to the Seleucid dealings with Ptolemaic Egypt and Judea, the 'feet of clay' can be regarded as the Seleucids. And my view is that Daniel was written as a Prophetic guarantee of victory for the Maccabean revolt.
Thus, it is long done and dusted and it is utterly absurd to relate it to the USA.
If it were done, Gods kingdom would have full control. But all can see satan still rules this system. We are nearing the end of these last days. We have all watched revelation unfold during our lifetimes.
If it were done, Gods kingdom would have full control. But all can see satan still rules this system. We are nearing the end of these last days. We have all watched revelation unfold during our lifetimes.
God solved that problem by crucifying his son -- God the Son. Jesus, God the Son, did ask that the cup be removed, but the Son submitted to God the Father. So, yes--we see an interaction between 2 persons of the Trinity.
If you wish to learn and understand, we can teach you. But if all you wish to do is stand back and lob insults, then no--you won't likely understand.
Why is “god” solving anything after the fact? He is supposed to know everything in advance. Why did “god” regret making Saul king? He should have known Saul would disobey him beforehand. Why did “god” give us two different accounts of Sauls death?
Your “god” is nothing more than Jewish folklore written by men.
Why is “god” solving anything after the fact? He is supposed to know everything in advance.
He did know it in advance. Genesis 3:15 is the protoevangelion -- the first first hint of the redeemer that would come. God knew it was going to happen, and he planned for it.
Quote:
Why did “god” regret making Saul king?
He should have known Saul would disobey him beforehand.
He wasn't surprised by it. But the word regret is an anthropomorphism -- it is a way of describing God in way we can understand. He was grieved by the sin of Saul.
Quote:
Why did “god” give us two different accounts of Sauls death?
Once they are used, it can be determined if that which is arrived at, and the journey itself, are distinctly possessed or shared.
Faith in God and its provisions contests materialism, whether the latter sits isolated or as an arsenal.
It could still be determined if they were at the same thing.
Yes - but that's the problem They all disagree about what the peak is called, what shape it is and even what colour it is. D'ye see the problem? It isn't that all but one has a false view - it is that they could all have a false view, and if they all have a false view of this mountain, who is to say there is even a mountain? It doesn't matter that nobody can prove there isn't one, but it matters that something better than conflicting claims there is one should be presented for it being real.
What religious faith contests directly is reason. It does that by asserting without evidence that invisible beings and realms exist (the supernatural) and has primacy over the natural (material) world. And so yes indirectly it opposes the physical as "all there is". This is not, however, a virtue.
The data used for evidence would be addressed- what it is, where it comes from, etc.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
