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Yeah, OK, I see what you are saying. We teach that Jesus is the only way to God. Also, we teach that if people don't accept Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior, they will be eternally separated from God. Guilty as charged.
But lets look at fear mongering.
Fear Mongering noun
The action of deliberately arousing public fear or alarm about a particular issue.
"His campaign for re-election was based on fearmongering and deception"
The definition, (and the dictionary-supplied example,) imply deception. Christians do not feel deceived by the Bible's description of the only way to God and the results of not accepting Jesus Christ as a savior, as you may recall when you used to be a Christian.
Call it what you will, but IMO to accuse Christians of "fear mongering" when we describe our beliefs is a misunderstanding of our intention and purpose.
Can you honestly tell me that if someone believes they are going to suffer damnation in hell and be eternally separated from God if they don't say the right words, that that may not instill at least a little fear in that person? Really? Yes, telling someone they have to believe what you do or go to hell is fear mongering. Call it what you will.
Slavery is now outlawed in every country on earth, despite the fact that the Bible supports and condones it. Genocide was practiced and condoned in the Bible, but is now an international crime. So, YES, the world has gotten to be a better place. In spite of the Bible. We can do better than the "morality" practiced in the Bible. And have.
Wikipedia
The Golden Rule
Ancient Egypt
Possibly the earliest affirmation of the maxim of reciprocity, reflecting the ancient Egyptian goddess Ma'at, appears in the story of The Eloquent Peasant, which dates to the Middle Kingdom (c. 2040–1650 BC): "Now this is the command: Do to the doer to make him do." This proverb embodies the do ut des principle.
A Late Period (c. 664–323 BC) papyrus contains an early negative affirmation of the Golden Rule: "That which you hate to be done to you, do not do to another. http://www.city-data.com/forum/newre...ly&p=50283456&
yeah, the book, thats easy pickens ...
love compassion, and understanding. Work hard, earn one's keep, and its one's duty to help others.
they call it christ like I call it common sense.
what was it that atheistic socialism has at its base root belief?
The example in the definition happened to include "and deception" in the sentence and yes, fear-mongering is often a tool of deception.
However all it really is, is evoking fear to get something you want, in your case, converts.
You may tell yourself it doesn't involve deception. For the sake of argument, let us assume that it does not. It is still arousing fear in others to a particular end.
I would not care, but for the fact that I have in my time met many people, many of them even Christians, who live in terror of eternal perdition and cannot escape the unvirtuous cycle of anxiety it produces. They don't "feel" saved and obsessively repent to no effect. They live their whole lives in fear of an asserted but unsubstantiated construct called "hell". People experience real suffering over this, even when they try their best to follow your formula for avoiding hellthreat.
I don't see why this is necessary. The JWs for example manage to retain people quite effectively despite being annihilationists. I suppose you see it as necessary because it's your dogma and you have to uphold it, but really, if your church simply provided a loving, supportive, encouraging environment for people to build community and refuge together, it seems like a real "build it and they will come" proposition to me. That you have to hold anything over anyone's head to attract or retain them is, it seems to me, a real red flag and sign of something fundamentally wrong with the ideology.
They have an extremely high turnover rate.* They use displeasing God as a method too and being destroyed at Armageddon. They are top notch in the fear mongering department plus they shun so if you leave you will lose all of your friends and possibly all of your family.
Can you honestly tell me that if someone believes they are going to suffer damnation in hell and be eternally separated from God if they don't say the right words, that that may not instill at least a little fear in that person? Really? Yes, telling someone they have to believe what you do or go to hell is fear mongering. Call it what you will.
Don't forget the phobia indoctrination where the demons are going to get you.
There's a big difference between doing something in the name of Christianity or in the name of atheism (the former which is common, the latter which is rare) and a Christian doing something or an atheist doing something.
err? this is not totally true. anti-religion goes by another name. anti-religious socialism.
they have cause a lot of trouble, harm, and disharmony.
but you are right. there is no need to slam a religion but there is plenty of reason to address irrational as much as we can. irrational behavior is independent of belief and is a personal responsibility. what ideology tries to pass the buck of responsibility to other things that are not even alive?
Can you honestly tell me that if someone believes they are going to suffer damnation in hell and be eternally separated from God if they don't say the right words, that that may not instill at least a little fear in that person? Really? Yes, telling someone they have to believe what you do or go to hell is fear mongering. Call it what you will.
It's a hell of a lot harder than just saying the right words. We have to deny ourselves and take up our crosses. It's not easy getting into Heaven. Most will fail.
It's a hell of a lot harder than just saying the right words. We have to deny ourselves and take up our crosses. It's not easy getting into Heaven. Most will fail.
Can you provide a confirmed list of those who have succeeded? Or are you simply assuming?
I get it. Atheism is great. It's the religion for people that can't control themselves.
I would love to be an atheist. You can do whatever the hell you want as long as you don't get caught.
I could have figured out a way to scam some unsuspecting people and make a lot of money in the process.
But yet...I am not an atheist.
I envy you though. Hopefully, you are not one of them fake atheists though. Because a real atheist will get ya and make ya put your hand in their pocket.
Wow! That is pretty amazing! I've been married to an atheist for over 40 years, and she is one of the most ethical and gracious people I know. It scares me to know there are people who only control themselves because god wants them to. Yikes!! How about, it's the right thing to do?
It doesn't answer my question however. Which was to request a firm list of those who you know for a fact who are actually in heaven. Authentication of this list will necessarily be required.
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