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Freedom from religion - in a lot of places. It seems to be working in the US at a rate of 5-10% every year or so. It may even be working in the Islamic countries too, but they have to be silent or they could end up in jail or dead.
Yes, Christianity was an improvement on Rome, and for a long time, it could claim to be the most advanced social system. But in fact Humanism has been taking over long before the Nones. Christian Fundamentalism in the US may go back further than we imagine. To the days of the frontier when religion arrived in the frontier towns and started a clean -up act. It got a boost with the religious revival in the Civil war, had an anti -science marker set down at the Scopes trial, and got a massive and official boost in the cold war. It's going to take a while to roll that back. They have money, power, influence and, I suspect Business interests, behind them. We have none of that, only the better case.
Christianity was like that once, taking on Rome. They won. So will we.
yeah. you did win in some places. vietnam, russia, n korea, china.
all we have to do is look at them to see you in charge.
Freedom from religion - in a lot of places. It seems to be working in the US at a rate of 5-10% every year or so. It may even be working in the Islamic countries too, but they have to be silent or they could end up in jail or dead.
Yes, Christianity was an improvement on Rome, and for a long time, it could claim to be the most advanced social system. But in fact Humanism has been taking over long before the Nones. Christian Fundamentalism in the US may go back further than we imagine. To the days of the frontier when religion arrived in the frontier towns and started a clean -up act. It got a boost with the religious revival in the Civil war, had an anti -science marker set down at the Scopes trial, and got a massive and official boost in the cold war. It's going to take a while to roll that back. They have money, power, influence and, I suspect Business interests, behind them. We have none of that, only the better case.
Christianity was like that once, taking on Rome. They won. So will we.
Freedom of religion , absolutely. It is guaranteed by laws/constitution, but I do not believe leaders themselves have to be agnostic.
Why is it frowned upon when Trump or any other right winger believes in their own faith? Why do they have to suppress it, since freedom of religion is allowed for any citizen right?
I believe more in culture & history than religion. And also believe religion shouldn't influence culture. For eg, I like French&Americans more than the British&Germans but Christianity has nothing to do with that. I may be wrong also.
Well, the problem with Trump is Trump, not what he believes. But the problem with Trump being president is who and what is behind him.
And for a long time, the US (and everywhere else) got along ok with religion. In the UK, I know Faith had been going back and forth with a decline after each war and a organized effort to gain ground again. I think that battle is lost for religion in Europe, but we mustn't let up - there is more to do.
In the US Bible -literalist Fundamentalism has had more of a grip although oddly not by the leadership until quite recently. The Cold war put religious clout in place and really with the rise of well -funded Creationism we saw Bible -literalist fundamentalism linked with Right -wing politics.Reagan, George and Dubhya Bush and now Trump.
Now, with separation of church and state, so long as the president wasn't an idiot, it didn't matter. But now it does, because I will risk all I have that the intent of the Religious right to to control the US politically, permanently and entirely. And that means Creationism instead of science, Bible literalism instead of science and in fact a Christian (and probably Baptist Fundy) Theocracy. Separation of church and state will vanish, the constitution will be deemed to say whatever they want. Science will dance to the Creationist tune, Legal and governmental bodies will toe the line and education will be solidly in the hands of Religious fundamentalism from Kindergarten to University level.
There was an old joke told about the Soviet Union.
"Comrade director, whom did you select to play Juliet? Valentina Slobodskaya or Ekaterina Yetshenko?."
"Neither. Olga Nataniova gets it."
"But she's fifty..is she the right choice..?"
"Comrade, she is a member of the Party."
That sort of control is what in on the agenda. I will bet my life on it.
It's not like the alternative was better. It was much worse. Christians chose the lesser of two evils.
I didn't like Hillary either but I hardly think she's "worse", particularly from an evangelical point of view, than a serially adulterous, dissembling megalomaniac with delusions of grandeur.
Clinton was at least not incompetent or ignorant or cruel. Or even dishonest to the extent the Orange One is.
Hillary's problem was that she was just another elitist / plutocrat and people are evidently tired enough of those that they accepted literally ANYTHING that wasn't.
I don't know what bothers me more -- that anyone still supports Trump, or that anyone supported Clinton.
I know what would bother me more, though, if I were still an evangelical: my fellow evangelicals selling their souls for a mess of pottage. Giving Trump a "Mulligan" for his open sin because evangelicals know all about second chances (per the statements last night by the head of the Family Research Council). Man, THAT cheapens the redemptive work of Christ way more than all the atheists in the whole wide world ever could.
Atheists haven't brainwashed millions into believing fairy tales. Also, haven't told them that same fairy tale demands a cut of their money, ie tithe.
that's not true.
atheists have brain washed millions into thinking anti-religion socialism is best. They have killed millions of more people that didn't agree with their anti-religious socialism ideas.
anti-religion socialism openly indoctrinate people using state run institutions.
Tithe? at least those people get to choose how much they give. I don't tithe, i get to choose not to give tithe's too.
Anti-religious socialism takes money (steals) from people to support other life styles that are not self sustainable or helpful to society.
Atheists haven't brainwashed millions into believing fairy tales. Also, haven't told them that same fairy tale demands a cut of their money, ie tithe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arach Angle
that's not true.
That is true.
But
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arach Angle
atheists have brain washed millions into thinking anti-religion socialism is best. They have killed millions of more people that didn't agree with their anti-religious socialism ideas.
anti-religion socialism openly indoctrinate people using state run institutions.
Tithe? at least those people get to choose how much they give. I don't tithe, i get to choose not to give tithe's too.
Anti-religious socialism takes money (steals) from people to support other life styles that are not self sustainable or helpful to society.
That is also true.
But it was socialism that was doing the brain washing, not atheism as such.
Atheists, who is your favorite non-believer historically and what did they accomplish that makes you admire them?
Believers, who is your favorite Believer historically and what did they accomplish that you admire?
A picture is worth many words so feel free to add a pic.
Hard to pick out an atheist 'from History' isn't it? Since historically within a Christian environment they wouldn't have admitted to not believing, for fear of - at best being ostracized from society and at worst labelled a heretic or worse by so-called 'Christians'.
So I don't see the point of your thread.
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