U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 01-30-2018, 05:38 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
14,026 posts, read 8,051,370 times
Reputation: 5959

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGrandK-Man View Post
"In an AOG church, the worship
experience is immersive by design.
Part of that is a high volume level,
particularly for the younger people.
You're going to get a LOT of pushback
I'll wager.
"


In our AoG, the congregation range from 3 to 83, and the push-back I did get was from members of the worship team, all younger than me.

Remember, this push for louder worship sound volume started about 7 months ago, and I have been going to this church for nearly 4 years, the latter three as a member. So it was not this loud when I first started attending. And you know what? On Sundays when my wife and I were away, some congregants said the band volume was out of control! I wasn't at the soundboard running the sound those days.
The only AOG church I ever actually attended was a megachurch with a couple thousand attending on a bad day, and I confess I had that memory in my head when replying to you. If the church is that small, and the push is coming from the musicians, then you have a lot more influence that I originally thought.

With this extra info it's sounding a lot more like over-enthusiastic musicians wrongly thinking that if they only crank the volume up loud enough everyone will enjoy that as much as they do. Your job sounds like simply conveying to them they are serving the congregation, not the inverse.

If you're a typical volunteer you have no real authority so it might be helpful to have the support of the pastor. But even absent that ... you sound like you're trying too hard to make nice, to the point of letting the musicians be a__holes. Just be the elder statesman and representative of what is, apparently, the desires of the congregation.

Also, try appealing to their artistry. Musicianship isn't all (or even mostly!) about decibels. Less is more. To use an organ analogy you might relate too ... it sounds like they're playing with the swell fully open and all stops drawn all the time. Leave something in reserve for rare use so that it really makes a statement.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-30-2018, 06:31 PM
 
3,157 posts, read 1,055,014 times
Reputation: 830
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGrandK-Man View Post
I have been attending a lovely, Spirit-led AG church now for nearly four years. I have been running their sound for a good part of that time, but lately I feel that the volume level has gotten out of hand.

They recently installed a digital audio console that is largely set and forget, but even when I was running the sound the levels they demanded from me, lately, bordered on the painful to listen to.

This is unfortunate because my wife and I both go there, and feel that we are growing in God together. The Pastor, in his mid-sixties, is very down to Earth and isn't afraid to preach the good and bad in the Bible, so that we have a good grasp of God's word.


I have even considered going back to the 'pipe organ' Lutheran I grew up in(I'm not really a fan of rock n roll worship song), but everyone I've talked to says it isn't a good idea for spouses to attend separate churches, even Christian ones.
Did Jesus worship with music? Ask yourself, and honestly answer the question from your own heart!

If you are brave enough and have an open mind then dig some research and you will probably find that Jesus worshipped in peace and serenity. He postrated in pray like the Muslims prayers are done.

This music introduction into the churches was only a way to attract more people because music creates an addiction. There is no message of Jesus in music. It's only a money making industry.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-30-2018, 07:35 PM
 
Location: Northeastern US
14,026 posts, read 8,051,370 times
Reputation: 5959
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals View Post
There is no message of Jesus in music. It's only a money making industry.
Said the Muslim, to the Christian who makes zero money volunteering for his music ministry. For the benefit of a congregation that claims to get all sorts of inspiration from the music -- when it's not rendering them deaf.

You believers are pretty amusing sometimes ... arguing about how loud music should be, whether music is of the devil to begin with ... don't you ever get weary of it?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-30-2018, 07:50 PM
 
Location: minnesota
4,090 posts, read 1,270,633 times
Reputation: 1505
Quote:
Originally Posted by mordant View Post
Said the Muslim, to the Christian who makes zero money volunteering for his music ministry. For the benefit of a congregation that claims to get all sorts of inspiration from the music -- when it's not rendering them deaf.

You believers are pretty amusing sometimes ... arguing about how loud music should be, whether music is of the devil to begin with ... don't you ever get weary of it?
He does have a point. from the link I posted.

It’s an Altered State. According to Blesser, loud music can cause an altered state of consciousness because of the highjacking of the senses mentioned above. “If you’re listening to really loud music, you can’t think straight. You can’t even focus on what you’re seeing,” he says. Essentially, it suppresses your other senses and changes how you perceive the world. He goes on to say, “A teenager’s proclivity for loud music is not unlike a teenager’s proclivity for alcohol and drugs.” Teenagers like to experience the world in new and different ways, and the altered state of mind accompanied by listening to loud music is no exception.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-30-2018, 09:35 PM
 
Location: Cleaning CAT VOMIT out of radiators
1,544 posts, read 433,341 times
Reputation: 1316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thoreau424 View Post
That's a hard call. Seems reasonable - and sane - to try to bring down the volume. Maybe you can get them to explain the benefit to high volume. Listen to their answers, and see if they make any sense. All I can imagine is that they'll say that it's necessary to bring in people, or keep them, but that's sort of a crock. There's nothing biblical about that. It'd just be worldly or churchy/religious, not anything spiritually or biblically based.

You could bring up things like safety levels, that it's harder to hear God's "still small voice" if all we want is volume, that worship in Jesus' time never needed electrical reinforcement, etc. You might find a good video somewhere (YouTube?) where someone's maybe discussed all of this, so it would be a neutral person explaining it.

Try these things, but look for the hearts and minds of the response. See if they're too caught up with this trend to wake up. This may be out of control and unresolvable. It's maybe come to that point. Maybe another church will be better for you and for God.

Well, as far as re-churching goes, I feel that our present church overall has enhanced our relationship with God. And it would be indeed a tough sell to get my wife to go along back to my Lutheran nearby, or to any other church for that matter. On days when the worship volume is exceptionally loud, she will just sit back a row or two from her customary pew. And our friends and fellow church-goers have verbalized that they believe that 'his church'/'her church' would not be good for our marriage.

I'm presently thinking of sitting out the 30-35min worship portion of service, and coming up from the basement fellowship hall only when I hear the Pastor commencing benediction and announcement of offering collection. Then I know the sermon, the meat of the service, which I record and distribute on CD, is soon to follow.

Last edited by TheGrandK-Man; 01-30-2018 at 09:50 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-30-2018, 09:37 PM
 
Location: Cleaning CAT VOMIT out of radiators
1,544 posts, read 433,341 times
Reputation: 1316
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals View Post
Did Jesus worship with music? Ask yourself, and honestly answer the question from your own heart!

If you are brave enough and have an open mind then dig some research and you will probably find that Jesus worshipped in peace and serenity. He postrated in pray like the Muslims prayers are done.

This music introduction into the churches was only a way to attract more people because music creates an addiction. There is no message of Jesus in music. It's only a money making industry.
Even if His name is in the lyrics? "What a beautiful Name it is, the Name of Jesus..."?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-30-2018, 09:51 PM
 
Location: Gulf Coast Texas
24,028 posts, read 12,839,136 times
Reputation: 9023
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGrandK-Man View Post
I have been attending a lovely, Spirit-led AG church now for nearly four years. I have been running their sound for a good part of that time, but lately I feel that the volume level has gotten out of hand.

They recently installed a digital audio console that is largely set and forget, but even when I was running the sound the levels they demanded from me, lately, bordered on the painful to listen to.

This is unfortunate because my wife and I both go there, and feel that we are growing in God together. The Pastor, in his mid-sixties, is very down to Earth and isn't afraid to preach the good and bad in the Bible, so that we have a good grasp of God's word.


I have even considered going back to the 'pipe organ' Lutheran I grew up in(I'm not really a fan of rock n roll worship song), but everyone I've talked to says it isn't a good idea for spouses to attend separate churches, even Christian ones.
Alright - another sound guy.

What's the general db level during the worship?

Our worship was loud (around 95dbA, 103 dbC at times)... and the worship leader and I would go back and forth... he wanted it loud so that he could get what he wanted... but I knew it was too loud in the room.

Years later and two worship ministers later, I figured out how to run the board at better levels where I can everyone what they need without it being too loud.

But I feel your pain being a sound guy and knowing that it's too loud. I am definitely not a set it and forget it guy.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-31-2018, 07:47 AM
 
Location: Cleaning CAT VOMIT out of radiators
1,544 posts, read 433,341 times
Reputation: 1316
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
Alright - another sound guy.

What's the general db level during the worship?

Our worship was loud (around 95dbA, 103 dbC at times)... and the worship leader and I would go back and forth... he wanted it loud so that he could get what he wanted... but I knew it was too loud in the room.

Years later and two worship ministers later, I figured out how to run the board at better levels where I can everyone what they need without it being too loud.

But I feel your pain being a sound guy and knowing that it's too loud. I am definitely not a set it and forget it guy.
Another problem is our sanctuary itself is small: 70' deep by 40' wide, roof peaks out at 20' high. Altar/stage is 24" elevated above main floor.

Mackie 12" powered pair mains, two 10" Behringers wedges plus new IEMs for monitoring. Operating this system in unity(PFLs around 0dB RMS, input faders between -5 to 0, Mains at 0), would blow out my hometown 130'x50'x40' Lutheran ELCA organ church! Let alone our little sanctuary. lol!

So for most of the time I was running everything at less than optimal levels - input gain PFLs -5 to -10, mix faders between -15 to -10, Mains at -5, and volume was still barely tolerable. Mackie mains levels at 12 o'clock. Now with new digital mixer and saved 'scenes' for both us and our tenant Spanish speaking church, levels have crept back upward toward almost painful.

So basically it's difficult to run even a modest system, like ours, in it's 'zone' without deafening half the congregation and even disturbing private residences within 100' of such a small sanctuary.

Yet my Pastor continues to proclaim to me "if you think this is loud you should hear how the Spanish group ran their worship - the whole(adjoining) parsonage house shook" Until they agreed to turn it down - a little.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-31-2018, 08:19 AM
 
948 posts, read 268,858 times
Reputation: 1315
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGrandK-Man View Post
Another problem is our sanctuary itself is small: 70' deep by 40' wide, roof peaks out at 20' high. Altar/stage is 24" elevated above main floor.

Mackie 12" powered pair mains, two 10" Behringers wedges plus new IEMs for monitoring. Operating this system in unity(PFLs around 0dB RMS, input faders between -5 to 0, Mains at 0), would blow out my hometown 130'x50'x40' Lutheran ELCA organ church! Let alone our little sanctuary. lol!

So for most of the time I was running everything at less than optimal levels - input gain PFLs -5 to -10, mix faders between -15 to -10, Mains at -5, and volume was still barely tolerable. Mackie mains levels at 12 o'clock. Now with new digital mixer and saved 'scenes' for both us and our tenant Spanish speaking church, levels have crept back upward toward almost painful.

So basically it's difficult to run even a modest system, like ours, in it's 'zone' without deafening half the congregation and even disturbing private residences within 100' of such a small sanctuary.

Yet my Pastor continues to proclaim to me "if you think this is loud you should hear how the Spanish group ran their worship - the whole(adjoining) parsonage house shook" Until they agreed to turn it down - a little.
They make these cool little devices known as "ear plugs". Check them out!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-31-2018, 10:49 AM
 
Location: Northeastern US
14,026 posts, read 8,051,370 times
Reputation: 5959
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGrandK-Man View Post
Yet my Pastor continues to proclaim to me "if you think this is loud you should hear how the Spanish group ran their worship - the whole(adjoining) parsonage house shook" Until they agreed to turn it down - a little.
So your pastor is an inconsiderate, disacknowledging, gaslighting jerk. Yet you get spiritual nourishment from him somehow. I confess I have no useful advice to give you.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2017, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32 - Top