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What do you think of this kind of experience? She said that she used to have a more medical/scientific understanding about this, until she actually experience it for herself.
Part of the "message" I think she received is that God uses other people to help us. In other words, everyone needs other people. She needed people (the medical technicians in this case) to help bring her back to life.
What do you think of this kind of experience [NDE]?
I think they should be compared and studied to inform our knowledge of the brain, consciousness, time-perception, agency perception, proprioception, etc. when someone is dying and their brain is going through various changes etc.
The Myth of Er, is a story from ancient Greece about an NDE (although the death/coma lasted for a week).
There are NDE of atheists going to hell, and of atheists experiencing cartoons (non-heavenly nor non-hellish).
What do you think of this kind of experience? She said that she used to have a more medical/scientific understanding about this, until she actually experience it for herself.
I think she's a person who always 'hoped there was more' ... because she openly states this in her first-person biography on her Amazon page. Then she had an extremely emotional experience wherein she almost died, and she attributes the strange feelings during that experience to ... the 'more' she always hoped there would be.
So?
I've 'seen stars'. Literally, my eyes were detecting light that that detection was not caused by photons. There's an explanation for this, and it isn't God (though you can bet that there have been people and cultures around the world who didn't know any better, and in fact did pass of 'seeing stars' as some sort of mystical experience). We all dream, and I have some pretty wild ones. They're not spiritual experiences. They're not clairvoyance or presagings of the future. They're just my imagination.
I think no more of her experience than I do of some Medieval peasant being awed by a comet or sun dogs in the winter sky.
Basically, we see all sorts of things that are not there, that aren't real. That - especially in light of her admitted wishes that she wanted to see such things and to believe that they were real - is a far better explanation than inventing things (deities) for which we have no more compelling evidence than pixies.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzzyRules
Part of the "message" I think she received is that God uses other people to help us. In other words, everyone needs other people. She needed people (the medical technicians in this case) to help bring her back to life.
Her message is that when an SUV runs over you and you're severely injured and would die but for medical intervention, the fact that you get that medical intervention from people who have spent many years studying techniques derived from decades and centuries of applying the scientific method to the human body and treatment of injuries, we can thank God for demonstrating that we need other people?
It seems to me that the fact that we need other people is self-evident and demonstrated every day. I don't own any cows, yet I drank milk this morning. I don't mine iron yet I own a lot of things made of steel. When I had pneumonia, I didn't self-diagnose the problem and I didn't manufacturer the antibiotics that put me on the path to recovery. I choose to live with a person (my wife), I have chosen to raise kids, I socialize with others. Of course we need people to live, both practically and as a matter of emotional satisfaction. And I didn't need a deity to run over a bicycling woman with an SUV to demonstrate this fact to me.
Nor, really, does anyone who thinks about the notion for more than a few seconds.
Congrats to Nancy. She's now happier. So are sasquatch hunters who are convinced they caught sight of Bigfoot, and people like Whitley Strieber, a science fiction writer who thinks he was abducted by aliens. And I'm sure they're every bit as sincere as Nancy Rynes.
When people have experiences, they are usually culturally related. From religious to flying saucers. So it sounds to me as if NDEs are our brains trying to make sense of what is happening based on our cultural expectations.
All you have is a pool of people who have been heavily contaminated by near-death experiences, concepts of an after-life and religious views.
What sort of a control group do you think would work? ...in contrast to the weak and suggestible who obviously couldn't resist such experiments.
Sorry, but this doesn't wash. If you've read enough NDE accounts - it sounds like you haven't -, you may appreciate that many of those who have them struggle to deal with the profundity of their experience, so much so that they have difficulty talking about it to others afterwards.
There will always be a proportion of flakes at the extremes of the distribution of NDE interviewees - those who haven't had an NDE but fantasize about it - but by definition there will be the larger body of genuine, credible people who have nothing to make up or embellish.
What sort of a control group do you think would work? ...in contrast to the weak and suggestible who obviously couldn't resist such experiments.
Sorry, but this doesn't wash. If you've read enough NDE accounts - it sounds like you haven't -, you may appreciate that many of those who have them struggle to deal with the profundity of their experience, so much so that they have difficulty talking about it to others afterward.
There will always be a proportion of flakes at the extremes of the distribution of NDE interviewees - those who haven't had an NDE but fantasize about it - but by definition, there will be the larger body of genuine, credible people who have nothing to make up or embellish.
Encountering the reality of God is an experience that has no counterpart in human experience. It must always be interpreted using the individual's accumulated experiences and benchmarks. That is probably what accounts for the cultural bias in the accounts. But it is an unmistakable and life-altering experience.
1. she had out of body experience. Not near death one.
2. 4 min is not enough to be "dead". It's actually between 15 and 20. Some did better than that.
3. I see nothing in her description that qualifies it as "heaven". In religious sense, of course.
4. I am glad she returned back to life with a purpose. Same time, somehow, I can't develop much respect to a person that uses "Stuff" as intelligent descriptor to some grand knowledge passed onto her. Sorry.
5. It's self promotion. Her, her book, her site. She "got on TV". YouTube is modern day TV equivalent. How should I put it. Those who had TRUE connection with Intelligences dwelling in The Realm of Permanence, rather do not develop inclinations to go public and "cure the world". Selling "stuff" along the mission.
1. she had out of body experience. Not near death one.
2. 4 min is not enough to be "dead". It's actually between 15 and 20. Some did better than that.
3. I see nothing in her description that qualifies it as "heaven". In religious sense, of course.
4. I am glad she returned back to life with a purpose. Same time, somehow, I can't develop much respect to a person that uses "Stuff" as intelligent descriptor to some grand knowledge passed onto her. Sorry.
5. It's self promotion. Her, her book, her site. She "got on TV". YouTube is modern day TV equivalent. How should I put it. Those who had TRUE connection with Intelligences dwelling in The Realm of Permanence, rather do not develop inclinations to go public and "cure the world". Selling "stuff" along the mission.
That's why it's called "near death".
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