Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I think you've been exposed to some sort of a warped kind of Christianity. Fear should not be part of it. You can't force yourself to believe something that doesn't make sense to you. I hope you are not genuinely afraid of going to hell because of what you've been told by a few fear-mongers. That's no way to spend your life.
I have realized this. Not all Christianity is fear-mongering. The warped fear-mongering Christian denomination is Catholicism, in my eyes. All virtue based, constant fear mongering. It seems they all question their salvation. From reading the bible myself, it is clear to me that Jesus is the pathway to salvation and heaven, not good works! From reading the bible I have also concluded that good works are not useless, but upon receiving the holy spirit, we are guided naturally to goodness (although are not ever capable to be sinless).
That is satisfying enough for me.
I've still got some work to do before I've achieved true conviction, but I've made some progress.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuminousTruth
How have you been? I hope well. I also hope to see you again soon.
Yeah, or skinned knees or even bad hair days. God should never have let anything bad happen to us, and the fact that bad stuff does happen is proof there's no God. Any idiot should be able to figure that out.
I sort of agree, but at the same time I do believe that the free will we are granted comes at some sort of price. What do you think?
A brief bit about me. I am in my early twenties, was raised without religion, family is not keen on religion. I've recently been exposed to Christianity and have been stricken with fear of hell, and now I am hedging my bets TRYING to believe.
I have been reading more and more about Christianity, and what I've deduced is that all you need to do to get into heaven is accept and believe that Jesus is the son of God and died for our sins.
It seems that once we have accepted Him, he gives us the power to overcome sin (not fully, but to an extent).
When I ask how I can see and believe in Jesus, I am frequently told to seek him and read the bible. Jesus reveals himself in the bible. What that REALLY sounds like to me is that the more you read the bible, the more BRAINWASHED you become, and then you "see" or "experience" him.
What I have always fundamentally believed is that there is some sort of higher power. I believe in the natural laws of the universe, karma, etc. because I have seen them work out myself.
It really seems to me that Christianity (and other religions) are merely extreme guilt trips and fear mongers.
What do you guys think?
There is no evidence for hell (or heaven). They don't exist. Do you fret about spirits, trolls, and ghosts? They don't exist either. Don't worry about them.
There is no evidence for hell (or heaven). They don't exist. Do you fret about spirits, trolls, and ghosts? They don't exist either. Don't worry about them.
It is not that easy for me to rule them out. Because I believe that there is something greater than us, I cannot easily rule out that this "God" has not communicated with us somehow (i.e. the bible) and also does not have stipulations and rules (you need to do x y and z or else be "separated from God" and subsequently be cast to hell). I do not think these things are necessarily illogical, however to me they are very nebulous. Because of this, I cannot rule them out so easily.
And, I do believe in the paranormal (ghosts/spirits). Trolls are simply from fables, not even comparable.
Last edited by iAmTheReckoner; 07-01-2018 at 02:45 PM..
Reason: Worded things differently.
It is not that easy for me to rule them out. Because I believe that there is something greater than us, [snip]
Help me understand how one comes to believe in concepts such as heaven, hell and god simply because they believe that there is something greater than us?
Just because you sense or believe that there is something greater than us why does this default you into believing in a heaven, hell or god?
It seems to be a very limiting practice to box in the mysteries of the Universe to very narrow and constrained human designed constructs such as heaven, hell and a god.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iAmTheReckoner
I cannot easily rule out that this "God" has not communicated with us somehow (i.e. the bible) and also does not have stipulations and rules (you need to do x y and z or else be "separated from God" and subsequently be cast to hell).
This is the damage and lies fed to people by Christianity and other Abrahamic religions. The bible was written by humans and if you actually pay attention to the bible and all the various forms of it you will find inconsistencies in events, heresy and just silly nonsense.
I suggest you listen to your own words.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iAmTheReckoner
What that REALLY sounds like to me is that the more you read the bible, the more BRAINWASHED you become, and then you "see" or "experience" him.
It really seems to me that Christianity (and other religions) are merely extreme guilt trips and fear mongers.
I also recommend you take a philosophy course in World Religions. This will advance your soul indeed!
Help me understand how one comes to believe in concepts such as heaven, hell and god simply because they believe that there is something greater than us?
Just because you sense or believe that there is something greater than us why does this default you into believing in a heaven, hell or god?
It seems to be a very limiting practice to box in the mysteries of the Universe to very narrow and constrained human designed constructs such as heaven, hell and a god.
This is the damage and lies fed to people by Christianity and other Abrahamic religions. The bible was written by humans and if you actually pay attention to the bible and all the various forms of it you will find inconsistencies in events, heresy and just silly nonsense.
I suggest you listen to your own words.
I also recommend you take a philosophy course in World Religions. This will advance your soul indeed!
It does not "default" me, it is accordance to what is supposedly the word of God (The Bible). I believe, at minimum, that there is A God. Is it so illogical to believe that said God may have a divinely inspired text? I am not necessarily stating the bible as complete fact. I want to emphasize that I have not achieved conviction, but none of the Atheist/Ex-Christian accounts have been convincing enough to me for me to abandon my research into religion, namely Christianity.
What have you been able to conclude from a World Religions course, and can you please give me some resources to study what you are speaking of here? What I would need to put my inquiry of Christianity to rest is proof that it is a human designed construct. If you've got anything for me that can ease my mind so I can sleep tonight I would be grateful.
It does not "default" me, it is accordance to what is supposedly the word of God (The Bible).
I think you're on to something!
Quote:
Originally Posted by iAmTheReckoner
I believe, at minimum, that there is A God.
Are you able to define this god you believe in? What are it's defining attributes?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iAmTheReckoner
Is it so illogical to believe that said God may have a divinely inspired text?
Yes! Absolutely illogical. Do you know how many supposed gods there have been throughout history? Do you know how many supposed divinely inspired Abrahamic religion holy texts there are? Each one of these texts contradicts the other. The fact that you were not born in a predominately Muslim country is the only reason you are ascribing to the Christian text. It's illogical to claim the text you want to follow is the true text and the other texts are false even though they are also supposedly divinely inspired.
Next go look at other supposedly inspired holy texts and explain why you are not following those texts as well?
Why not follow the gods that existed before the invention of the Abrahamic religions?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iAmTheReckoner
I am not necessarily stating the bible as complete fact.
Great as I would be busting those myths left and right with evidence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iAmTheReckoner
I want to emphasize that I have not achieved conviction, but none of the Atheist/Ex-Christian accounts have been convincing enough to me for me to abandon my research into religion, namely Christianity.
You don't need anyone to convince you to abandon your research into Christianity. All it takes is keeping an open perspective, researching how Christianity came into existence, researching the history of religion, and keep questing what they are trying to make you believe.
It does not take believing in any particular religion to evolve your consciousness to be a loving, compassionate and kind soul. You are born with these innate traits...and if they are not well expressed in you then you can find lots of ways to cultivate them within you. Deep introspection of yourself and behaviors is a good start, learning how to properly meditate is a second great tool. Exercising and healthy lifestyle is a huge part of it. You can embark upon a journey of awakening and evolving higher thinking and higher consciousness...it takes work and daily practice. It takes doing vs. simply believing in what your choice of religion tells you to believe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iAmTheReckoner
What have you been able to conclude from a World Religions course, and can you please give me some resources to study what you are speaking of here?
I learned that all religions teach the same theme with just different players and silly "must believe this or else" instructions! I learned of all of the cult tactics used to lured the unsuspecting and those who don't question. I learned how narrow and constrained the ways of achieving higher consciousness are taught.
I learned the history of world religions and all the 1000's of gods that were invented. Why don't you believe in Zeus...after all he was one of the first gods ever worshiped?
Quote:
Originally Posted by iAmTheReckoner
What I would need to put my inquiry of Christianity to rest is proof that it is a human designed construct. If you've got anything for me that can ease my mind so I can sleep tonight I would be grateful.
Read the Old Testament front to back.
You are going to have to find this answer out for yourself. I have no knowledge of how scientifically literate you are or what your understanding of how the Universe came into existence is. There are tons of logical/philosophical insights that would make you drop believing in religions without a doubt, however until you introspect on these insights you won't ever know what I mean. I just have no way of knowing how evolved your mind is. You can't help a creationist understand evolution...know what I mean?
it is clear to me that Jesus is the pathway to salvation and heaven, not good works! From reading the bible I have also concluded that good works are not useless, but upon receiving the holy spirit, we are guided naturally to goodness (although are not ever capable to be sinless).
u.
Its a 2 part deal.
Paul said faith without works is dead.
Peter said the opposite.
Both are correct because both are needed.
One speaks of the roots of faith.
The other speaks of the fruits of faith.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Don't worry. There is no hell
