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Old 10-07-2018, 03:58 PM
 
Location: NJ
2,668 posts, read 1,245,701 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
Funny, I found "2Take with you words and return to the LORD; say to him, “Take away all iniquity; accept what is good, and we will pay with bulls the vows of our lips."

Why would that be?
Probably because you are using a Christian translation of a Jewish text. Try "Take words with you And return to the LORD. Say to Him: “Forgive all guilt And accept what is good; Instead of bulls we will pay [The offering of] our lips."
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Old 10-07-2018, 04:00 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
17,071 posts, read 10,826,320 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
So why do they insist that they are connected to us or we need to be connected to them?...
Good question. The only real connection is that this particular development of perception of God's nature and our relationship with Him came through this particular ethnic development.

I'd say that the reason is the ridiculous idea that the whole Bible is a message FROM God rather than the various perceptions ABOUT God in the history and development of the Hebrew ethnic religion. I'ts something they came up with to counter the Catholic claimof authority resting in the Church (equally ridiculous).
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Old 10-07-2018, 04:02 PM
 
Location: Red River Texas
22,834 posts, read 10,236,681 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rosends View Post
Probably because you are using a Christian translation of a Jewish text. Try "Take words with you And return to the LORD. Say to Him: “Forgive all guilt And accept what is good; Instead of bulls we will pay [The offering of] our lips."
I have been saying the same thing for a long time, I just expand it with each sacrifice. Nate doesn't accept the Old Testament if I remember correctly.
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Old 10-07-2018, 04:24 PM
 
Location: US
32,530 posts, read 21,853,082 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
Funny, I found "2Take with you words and return to the LORD; say to him, “Take away all iniquity; accept what is good, and we will pay with bulls the vows of our lips."

Why would that be?

Could it have anything to do with the fact that Hosea was Northern kingdom away from Jerusalem?
Hoshea - Hosea - Chapter 14

3 Take words with yourselves and return to the Lord. Say, "You shall forgive all iniquity and teach us [the] good [way], and let us render [for] bulls [the offering of] our lips.

Hmmm, looks like the Rabbi is correct...
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Old 10-07-2018, 04:42 PM
 
Location: Southwestern, USA, now.
21,020 posts, read 19,214,293 times
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I love a man who brings up Hosea.
Besides the Crucifixion, it is the story that depicts the most accurate, humble example of
the pure love that God Is.
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Old 10-07-2018, 04:48 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannibal Flavius View Post
I have been saying the same thing for a long time, I just expand it with each sacrifice. Nate doesn't accept the Old Testament if I remember correctly.
Nate doesn't accept the idea that the Old Testament is a message FROM God, but primary material in a study of the development of the ethnic Hebrew religion down to the life and ministry of Jesus.

Even if Hosea indicated what Rosends and Richard say it does, it is a later development in the Northern kingdom religion, which at least parallels if it is not a foundation for the development of Rabbinical Judaism after the destruction of the Temple.

Think Samaritans.
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Old 10-07-2018, 05:34 PM
 
Location: S. Wales.
50,079 posts, read 20,495,373 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
So why do they insist that they are connected to us or we need to be connected to them?...
It seems to have been a fear of losing legitimacy. Christianity could even have lost all the Jewish links if Marcion had been able to cut all Jewish references in the Bible that he was compiling. Other Christians saw that Christianity would compare badly with other religions that could trace their links back to ancient Egypt or Greece or Persia. So Marcion was denounced as a heretic and Christianity kept all the Jewish books that it liked. More or less.
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:06 PM
 
Location: Red River Texas
22,834 posts, read 10,236,681 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
Nate doesn't accept the idea that the Old Testament is a message FROM God, but primary material in a study of the development of the ethnic Hebrew religion down to the life and ministry of Jesus.

Even if Hosea indicated what Rosends and Richard say it does, it is a later development in the Northern kingdom religion, which at least parallels if it is not a foundation for the development of Rabbinical Judaism after the destruction of the Temple.

Think Samaritans.
A later development?


What year would you say that was?
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Old 10-07-2018, 10:21 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
17,071 posts, read 10,826,320 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannibal Flavius View Post
A later development?


What year would you say that was?
Approximately 800 BCE. When would you say that Moses was supposed to have given the Law?
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Old 10-08-2018, 12:36 AM
 
Location: Red River Texas
22,834 posts, read 10,236,681 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nateswift View Post
Approximately 800 BCE. When would you say that Moses was supposed to have given the Law?
I am still trying to make sense of your post, it doesn't make any sense.
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