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Agreed, there is the idea that consciousness is a property of the universe. But I have yet to see any evidence for this; and am always conscious (joke intended) that many people have a problem with the idea of something without a purpose, because we evolved this idea of purpose, whether one exists or not. So the idea that consciousness may just be an evolved trait is uncomfortable for some.
Consciousness is not a property of the universe? Can you show me where the property of the universe ends and begins? Show me one thing that is not a property of the universe? How are you not a property of the universe. That tree is not a property of the universe? Consciousness is not a property of the universe? I am the universe looking back at itself, it's where I came from, it is where I exist, and it is where I return to. Sounds pretty much that everything you can see or not see is a property of the universe.
And I have yet to see evidence of anything that is not a property of the universe. Where did it come from? where was it made? where was it going? Give me a hint.
How is it that everything you are, and everything you was, and everything you will be, and everything you see or know, is not a product of the universe, the whole?
And why is it that you think that Consciousness as a property of the universe and that it may evolve, to develop gradually, is either one or the other and not one and the same?
Since you were born with consciousness, I would say your consciousness has evolved a lot.
Purpose is a product of a thinking mind, and purpose does not exist without a thinking mind. The thinking mind is what gives things a purpose or not: otherwise nothing has any purpose whatsoever. You can see no purpose for a car, then a car has no purpose for you. It is an idea that gives a car purpose, not evidence. I can see lots of purposes for a car, then a car has lots of purposes for me.
No purpose for the solar system, no purpose for the leaves to fall from a tree? No purpose for the rain? I am consciousness, I see a purpose for the universe...how much consciousness does it require to see no purpose in things. Why does your heart beat, no purpose? Something causes it to beat, and something causes it to do something to cause it to beat, and something caused that, and something caused that, and on and on it goes even if consciousness can see no purpose in anything. No purpose for the universe? How hard was that for you guys to come up with and fix that opinion as evidence?
Nothing has any purpose except man and what man creates, even the air that he breaths has no purpose unless he puts it in a can and goes underwater. How dumb is that?
A headache. It is not a property of the universe, it is just a part of it. Especially at this time of year.
Last edited by mensaguy; 01-02-2019 at 04:34 PM..
Reason: fixed quote tag
lmao, some people just refuse to see how anything done by you is actually the universe doing it.
there is no logic around it. "artificial" is useful in communication between people, but anything we make; the universe is actually the thing that did it. its just silly to play word games around it.
It almost seems like they wilfully ignore reality to maintain a statement of belief about god (yes god or no god)
what type of god do you believe in aura? can you some it up quickly for me?
And here I thought a property of the universe is a part of the universe.
I think I am a bit confused by some of this conversation. It appears to me that you are claiming that any property of a portion of a complex system is inherently a property of the whole system, but surely that isn't where you are going with it?
I would remove the word "inherently". Yes, it really is about traits we assign to the events we see around us. what is the single best notion that offers a mechanism, explanation, and makes predictions.
there is not one thing alive in a cell, we classify that complexity in that volume as life. A cell shares some properties with its nonliving counterpart, but it also has a lot more.
you are made up of cells. How we classify that cell is how we classify things made up of "cells". yeah, that's true enough.
what separates you from Bacteria/Eubacteria? what separates you from the cells/systems in you? You don't look like and act like a digestive system. Buut none the less ... that system is a trait of you.
well, by any reasonable sense of logic, as larger and larger portions of the universe interact with one another, what property will emerge? something that many people wouldn't predict? Using what we observe, the universe being based on hierarchy of structure, what "structure" may emerge?
well, to answer this a measurement and calculations would, at least, help. Complexity vs volume rations, compare the earth's system to living and nonliving objects, speed up the cosmos in super fast time. what patterns would we see and what do we have that we could compare it to so that we could at least make a measurement?
this process only answers what is the best description for what we are in right now. it doesn't answer any grand meaning.
Purpose/intent actually is a product of a mind, if there is no Mind anywhere, purpose or intent does not exist. It takes a mind to know if your heart is beating for a purpose or not, or if the fuel pump on your car has a purpose or not.
But I'm not sure what you're really asking...
Last edited by mensaguy; 01-03-2019 at 04:16 AM..
Reason: removed extra quote tag
And here I thought a property of the universe is a part of the universe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoCapo
I think I am a bit confused by some of this conversation. It appears to me that you are claiming that any property of a portion of a complex system is inherently a property of the whole system, but surely that isn't where you are going with it?
-NoCapo
The fallacy of composition is only a fallacy if you think there are SEPARATE things. IF we use the perspective of a ONENESS to everything, then there are no separate systems and any attributes of any elements in the system are attributes of the ONE system as a whole.
A body against itself, not working together for the whole. Selfishness.
All the parts or properties together is what we call the universe. Selflessness.
And of all the properties of the universe, Man is an entity of death and destruction upon the earth and all the universe, if possible. Man goes to mars? how's the wars going on mars? They still killing each other? Like cancer spreading.
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