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Old 11-15-2018, 05:09 AM
 
3,478 posts, read 2,370,457 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Diogenes View Post
I came into existence a few hours after my parents had sex. The parts that I am made of came into existence with the universe.
You believe life starts with conception. However, sperm are living viable creatures that in the least determine our genitalia.
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Old 11-15-2018, 05:18 AM
 
2,403 posts, read 1,350,650 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabfest View Post
At what point in time did you come into existence? The father carries the spermatozoa. Spermatozoa carry spermatozoa.
If you are waiting for me to say who is the creator of spermatozoa, I don't know. What I want to know is where does religion, that contains no spermatozoa in the literal sense, fit into all of this? It never created any living thing.
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Old 11-15-2018, 05:21 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elyn02 View Post
If you are waiting for me to say who is the creator of spermatozoa, I don't know. What I want to know is where does religion, that contains no spermatozoa in the literal sense, fit into all of this? It never created any living thing.
In order to believe God has always existed, you must believe you've always existed.

Religions are algorithms for various Gods.
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Old 11-15-2018, 05:29 AM
 
2,968 posts, read 927,892 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals View Post
So what would you like to have instead?

Everyone would have been born a believer with no choice, and no ability to reason?
God had no problem with creating angels that are 100% believers, with the ability to reason, they can make choices, they have FREE WILL and are IMMORTAL.

god did that BEFORE inventing infallible, mortal humans, right GoCard?
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Old 11-15-2018, 08:11 AM
 
35,687 posts, read 9,508,475 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elyn02 View Post
If you are waiting for me to say who is the creator of spermatozoa, I don't know. What I want to know is where does religion, that contains no spermatozoa in the literal sense, fit into all of this? It never created any living thing.
I think we al know what the argument is - where we, a chicken or an came from is only a Rhetorical Q leading all the way back to 'who started life?' which is intended to be the atheist -stumper. When we explain the postulated explanation "You can't prove it". Tow which we say "You can't disprove it".

"Yes we can it could not happen by chance."

"Not by chance, but by known natural actions."

then the denial. That's your opinion.."Where you there?"

We have done the argument so often. And you are right. Even if it was a god that dunnit...which one?

cue the Other argument.

"There is only one god."

"Which one?"

"They all worship the same god."

"Again - which one?"

I have never been able to get a straight answer, so I'll give it (I'd have mane a damn' fine Theist)

"The True God is best expressed in the Bible, which is the only religion with a book that sets out the whole thing from first to last with verifiable history".

Which eventually brings us to the only part that matters - whether the Gospels are credible. That (to me at least) is the only question that matters and all the rest are really pointless arguments that serve only as atheist -stumpers. if they don't work, they try the next one. Infinite regression back to "Who made everything, then?" is (with abiogenesis -and 'consciousness') the ones they are sure they can dig in and not be shifted. But none of them are relevant to religion, which is really what the debate is about - as you pointed out.

And now I need a pipe up and some uv der hard stuff and rest me elbow.
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Old 11-15-2018, 08:23 AM
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
52,695 posts, read 51,835,163 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elyn02 View Post
Nice post.

I often wonder about Jesus's audience during his time. Did they just not think outside of the box, hold on to superstitions, or keep negative thoughts about themselves? They needed somebody to show them differently?
Well, from what we know, it appears to have been a very restrictive society with a close set of rules to be followed without question and everyone meant to stay within their assigned role within that culture. I view him as a guy who taught that following the rules wasn't always the best way when it meant that the rules trumped compassion for other human beings.
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Old 11-15-2018, 08:31 AM
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
52,695 posts, read 51,835,163 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmiej View Post
An acorn comes from an oak tree which comes from an acorn and so on. Neither creates the other. Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

Try again.
Sometimes they are served together in a dish on a Chinese menu, which inspired a Paul Simon song.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7kRFQf_d8I
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Old 11-15-2018, 08:50 AM
 
7,888 posts, read 4,677,465 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabfest View Post
I think if some other sperm had of swam faster, it would be a different person altogether...each sperm is coded differently.
So, you think what I think.
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Old 11-15-2018, 08:51 AM
 
Location: Germany
3,156 posts, read 559,216 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabfest View Post
You believe life starts with conception. However, sperm are living viable creatures that in the least determine our genitalia.
Eggs. I am a product of both parents.
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Old 11-15-2018, 08:54 AM
 
7,888 posts, read 4,677,465 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elyn02 View Post
Well, I would have to do some rereading in that period but I would like to stick with your original point, which is that the creator is greater than the created.

In the case of the amniotic egg, this allowed living creatures to move from a wet habitat to a dry habitat, thus giving the advantage to the genes of the incubator, and not to the actual incubator. So I think when we talk about what is greater, the discussion should focus on the genes that successfully passed on from incubator to egg and lead us here today.
It's kind of like asking which is greater: parent or child? The parent is older, but does that mean greater? The vast majority of parents will say the child is greater.
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