U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 01-30-2019, 02:12 AM
 
3,896 posts, read 1,422,382 times
Reputation: 1255

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
Did I confuse you?
I don't believe in heaven or hell. There. Clear.
If you don’t believe in heaven and hell then why do you believe that heaven may not be necessarily opposite of hell? Looks like you confused your own self rather than me.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-30-2019, 07:08 PM
 
Location: Texas
7,750 posts, read 2,901,366 times
Reputation: 16566
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillobyte View Post
I think we should wipe the word, "hell" from the English language and everything associated with it. There's not a single passage in the Bible that uses the word, "hell". It uses "sheol", "Gehenna" "Tartarus" possibly "Hades". It was the King James translators that turned all this into the Anglo-Saxon word, "hell" derived from the Nordic "Hel" the daughter of Loki who was cast down into an underworld of freezing cold. See how easily pagan myth filtered into the Christian religion in the Medieval period? But freezing cold didn't sound as frightening as burning fire so the Roman Catholics turned it into a burning pit of sulfurous flames to scare them dumb stubborn pagans into accepting Jesus.
The Bible actually does refer to it as a lake of fire, I believe.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-30-2019, 07:44 PM
 
38,252 posts, read 25,824,464 times
Reputation: 5921
Quote:
Originally Posted by PriscillaVanilla View Post
The Bible actually does refer to it as a lake of fire, I believe.
Actually, it describes the lake of fire as the ultimate fate of hell itself. Revelation 20:13 describes death and hell with reference to the lake of fire:

. . . And the sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hell gave up the dead that were in them; and they were judged each one according to their works. And hell and death were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-30-2019, 08:20 PM
 
Location: Texas
7,750 posts, read 2,901,366 times
Reputation: 16566
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Actually, it describes the lake of fire as the ultimate fate of hell itself. Revelation 20:13 describes death and hell with reference to the lake of fire:

. . . And the sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hell gave up the dead that were in them; and they were judged each one according to their works. And hell and death were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.
So if hell is not the lake of fire, how is hell described as being?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-31-2019, 05:30 AM
 
Location: Germany
3,397 posts, read 622,250 times
Reputation: 542
Quote:
Originally Posted by PriscillaVanilla View Post
So if hell is not the lake of fire, how is hell described as being?
Hell is a later idea mixing the various Jewish ideas of Gehenna, the lake of fire, and Sheol, where the dead went to await the end of times. Some Jews thought you were punished in Gehenna, others thought you were destroyed. Some Jews thought Sheol was divided into good and bad parts, where you were either punished or rewarded.

Revelations is talking about this earlier idea, not about the later idea of Hell.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-31-2019, 12:08 PM
 
11,505 posts, read 4,465,909 times
Reputation: 1248
Quote:
Originally Posted by PriscillaVanilla View Post
So if hell is not the lake of fire, how is hell described as being?
made up. like unicorns and dragons.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-31-2019, 12:14 PM
 
8,088 posts, read 3,595,358 times
Reputation: 1814
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monastic555 View Post
Do you think that the Afterlife has a literal Hell? By that I mean the Hell as taught by Islamics and Christians, that is, an actual place where people are burning in fire, tortured for all Eternity.
I believe the wicked should be punished. But why for*all eternity? That would be the height of Cruelty. Should they not get a chance to redeem themselves? According to those Bible-teachings, what disturbs me is that the torture will be eternal.
I think you could make a scriptural case for both sides of the argument, but I have taken a non-traditional view. I think the authors were just trying to describe in terms relatable to their physical world or culture at the time, much like they refer to God sitting on a throne. If I had to convey visual the most horrible place imaginable, it would be burning alive forever. I believe hell is either physical or spiritual time realm where God wipes out the unsaved from existence. There is no coming back from that death. It is eternal in that you will never be created again. I based this on Matthew 10:28

"Do not fear those who kill the body, but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in Hell.”

Jesus clearly says that everything about us, body and soul will be destroyed. Plus, it just doesn't make logical sense for God to keep people alive forever to torment them. This would mean God would have to create a new physical body with nerve endings that will experience the fire pain but the body does not get consumed. This is a great article that covers it in more depth

The Nature of Hell | Eternity | Lamb and Lion Ministries


At any rate, the thought of being told you will no longer exist anymore while knowing others go on to eternal life would be terrifying and horrible enough.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-31-2019, 12:26 PM
 
15,576 posts, read 7,821,391 times
Reputation: 2051
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40 View Post
<snip>... I based this on Matthew 10:28

"Do not fear those who kill the body, but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in Hell.”...
That verse isn't referring to God destroying anyone; the "him" being referred to is each person having the potential to destroy themselves, not in some mythical afterlife torture chamber, but in the here and now. (And the word someone translated as "hell" there is actually "Gehenna", a literal valley used as a garbage dump in that time period.)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-31-2019, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Ohio
18,645 posts, read 13,668,670 times
Reputation: 14692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monastic555 View Post
Do you think that the Afterlife has a literal Hell?
Why don't you do yourself a favor, and actually research the origin of Hell?

Hell and the concept of Hell was invented by the Greeks.

The Greeks had received texts from Chaldea, which was a kingdom in Mesopotamia, before it was taken over by the Amorites (the people everyone erroneously calls "Babylonians").

In translating those texts, the Greeks came across a word they didn't understand or know how to interpret, and based on their own biases and prejudices, incorrectly interpreted the word as "underworld."

Worse than that, they actually believed it was under the Earth.

Later, scholars continually compounded that error all the way up through the 1990s.

I can't remember the guy's name, but when the error was discovered, the translation was changed to "netherworld" due to their own biases and prejudices. That's still an incorrect translation, but it's a helluva lot better than "underworld" (pardon the pun).

The correct translation of that word is "below the equator."

The bias and prejudices among scholars doesn't allow them to believe that an older civilization could have possibly sailed from the Persian Gulf Region to the region of south Africa and engaged in trade, which is why it's incorrectly translated.

Anyway, that knowledge, incorrect as it may be, was transmitted to other cultures, because the Greeks were literally everywhere.

As incredible as it may be, the Greeks were world renown as administrators. Egypt imported Greeks to work as government administrators, as did all the civilizations in the Levant and Mesopotamia, and even the Persians imported Greeks to be administrators in their governments.

With the rise of Rome, nearly all of your government administrators were Greeks, and that was the case for the Ottoman Empire as well. All the administrators in the Ottoman Empire were Greeks, except for the Finance Ministry, which was run by Jews, and the Foreign Ministry, which only Turks could serve there.

Why do you think the Septuagint is in Greek?

Because there thousands of Greeks in the Levant, if not administering government, then administering merchants and trade.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-01-2019, 01:03 AM
 
35,962 posts, read 9,657,755 times
Reputation: 4898
Quote:
Originally Posted by PriscillaVanilla View Post
So if hell is not the lake of fire, how is hell described as being?
Presumably yet another contradiction - of which there are so many in the Bible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Diogenes View Post
Hell is a later idea mixing the various Jewish ideas of Gehenna, the lake of fire, and Sheol, where the dead went to await the end of times. Some Jews thought you were punished in Gehenna, others thought you were destroyed. Some Jews thought Sheol was divided into good and bad parts, where you were either punished or rewarded.

Revelations is talking about this earlier idea, not about the later idea of Hell.
Then 'hell' is actually the lake of fire while sheol was just a holding place for the dead who were later tossed into this lake of fire which is now thought of as Hell. Yes?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top