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Old 03-02-2019, 06:15 PM
 
11,920 posts, read 4,559,028 times
Reputation: 1273

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
No, it's a much more intimate and passionate issue.

Thus, more deserving of the respectful: in my opinion.
I am sorry. I won't do that. I will help people be the best people they can be while teaching them how to form a solid belief based on what we know. Believing the universe may be alive and loves you is quite different than believing in a god that is influencing our lives everyday in the manor that some religions teach.

the former I can give a wide berth to, it links back to the periodic table, although I am not sure I believe it. the latter is clearly less valid, it does not link to the standard model.

"opinions" that offer an explanation, mechanism, predictions, and repeatable" are more valid than "onions" that don't.

its that simple.

do you want to compare your claim using those? or tell me a better way to discern the a truth?

yes, I will treat children brains with more care than a mature brain. I am not opposed to doing that. But don't bring a children's brain state determining reality being on equal terms with a mature brains claims. or bring a "personal emotional need" as the defining statement that decides how the universe works.
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Old 03-02-2019, 06:39 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
20,556 posts, read 9,657,781 times
Reputation: 19421
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arach Angle View Post
yeah, jesus died and rose for our sins vs he did not ... isn't like deciding the prettiest lake in the land.
Nor do we need a lecture by Clara on how to write our postings.
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Old 03-02-2019, 06:41 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
20,556 posts, read 9,657,781 times
Reputation: 19421
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
No, it's a much more intimate and passionate issue.

Thus, more deserving of the respectful: in my opinion.
You're assuming respect for a point of view.
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Old 03-02-2019, 08:05 PM
 
38,561 posts, read 25,971,477 times
Reputation: 5940
Quote:
Originally Posted by TroutDude View Post
In my opinion, it's a really silly notion all round.

It's absurd that an Omni-God Thing would make so many mistakes and then come up with this stupid, convoluted notion that his son - who is really himself, only different - has to pretend to commit suicide and then clamber back up into heaven on the 2nd or 3rd day (depending on which anonymous scripture writer you're reading) in order to make it easy for people who said the Magic Words To Jesus to go to heaven when they died, even if they were total knobs during their earthly sojourn.
The extant primitive interpretations may be silly but that does not make the ubiquitous Savior template across eras, cultures, nations, and generations invalid.
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Old 03-02-2019, 08:11 PM
 
10,620 posts, read 10,892,564 times
Reputation: 3227
Quote:
Originally Posted by CasualVisitor View Post
Thrill...right up front---sorry, but I don't hate you. As much as you probably don't want it or receive it--I care about you.

Ok, in all truth, there's probably not a lot you could tell me about my faith and my beliefs that I've not already heard. I've been called empty minded, gullible, clueless, a cool aid drinker, and a few other more descriptive and "pointed" names. You, yourself, have grouped me as being part of "a plague". Yes, I've seen open hostility. OH, indeed I have. And, I've seen the laundry list...

Yet, seriously, feel free to share your thoughts. I'll even read them. I respect your right and I respect your thinking. I truly do...it's not just words I say to that effect.

But, I probably won't get into any sort of argument. Arguments about religion are usually pointless except, often, to promote yet more hostility. I share the message that God has given me. Some will consider, some will reject..and so it goes. Let he who has ears hear.

So, that might beg the question---why would I even visit this place casually or otherwise?

Simply put...to just so as I've said. Share what I've personally experienced in the hope it might help, assist, or whatever anyone that might, possibly...be "looking" for answers to their life.

You are not my intent or my focus.

You've made up your mind and are adamant in your rejection of God or anything of God...so be it. Now, might He supernaturally do something in your life to get your attention? Perhaps, He's entirely able. But probably not. He gives us Free Will. Again, you've rejected Him and His message...that is your choice and your right to do as such. I hope...I do hope that your mind will be changed one day before you stand in Judgement before Him...which you will.

But, I can't make that happen.
I appreciate the offer to talk, Casual. Let's have a....well, casual conversation. No rancor. I'll take your points one by one and reply. You can reply as well, please do.

Quote:
You, yourself, have grouped me as being part of "a plague".
Not at all. I was just joking.

Quote:
You've made up your mind and are adamant in your rejection of God or anything of God...so be it.
I don't reject God. I am not an atheist. I am a deist. I believe in God. I believe He is a God who doesn't intervene in our lives or the affairs of men on earth. He set everything in motion at the beginning of the creation of our solar system, put the spark of life into organisms and then set in motion evolution and then left us to our own devices. I support my view by pointing out that there is no scientific evidence of God moving in this world. Study after study proves that prayer does not work.

Quote:
Three years ago, a multi-million-dollar, controlled, double-blind study was conducted to test intercessory prayer.
The Study of the Therapeutic Effects of Intercessory Prayer (STEP) found two major results:
1) “Intercessory prayer had no effect on recovery from surgery without complications.”
2) “Patients who knew they were receiving intercessory prayer fared worse.”
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16569567

Make of that what you will but when I read the study several years ago after having no results when I prayed, I stopped praying and haven't prayed since.

Quote:
He gives us Free Will.
When someone says, "You are completely free to worship me or not and to choose Jesus or not. But if you make the choice not to accept Jesus then you will burn eternally in hell because your sins have not been forgiven" that is NOT giving us free will. That is like a thief holding a gun to someone's head and then saying, "Your money or your life. It's your choice."

Quote:
I do hope that your mind will be changed one day before you stand in Judgement before Him...which you will
I haven't seen anything to make me believe I will stand in judgement before God except words out of a 2000 year old book. If you have some concrete evidence to offer that this is the case I am more than willing to read it and if it's convincing enough I will change my mind and come back to Christianity. I am always willing to change my mind if I see compelling evidence. So far no Christian has been able to produce any. You're welcome to offer some.
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Old 03-02-2019, 08:55 PM
 
11,920 posts, read 4,559,028 times
Reputation: 1273
how come he had to 'set it in motion"? how about it living so we are here. or we are living so it is here?

Like a cell lives in you but you don't directly interfere with it. in a way that is.
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Old 03-02-2019, 11:10 PM
 
6,691 posts, read 3,969,883 times
Reputation: 662
Quote:
Originally Posted by L8Gr8Apost8 View Post
Who doesn't like a good underdog story?
Great response!
But, then...you are just cool like that.
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Old Yesterday, 12:25 AM
 
Location: Valencia, Spain
14,428 posts, read 9,967,578 times
Reputation: 2493
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
Jesus told his disciples to give everything to the poor, walk away from their father on the bank of the river, leave their home behind. He didn't call EVERYONE to be a disciple. He also had ardent followers who were funding his mission, I believe Mary Magdalene was one (one of the Marys funded him, I think maybe through her family's very lucrative shipping business).

The disciples weren't telling everyone give everything you have to the poor, and follow me. They told people to love one another as He has loved you, and care for one another.
Complete and utter balderdash. The NT contains the 'teachings' of the Christian man-god Jesus. Those teachings are universal and meant for ALL of you to follow so that you be 'good Christians, not just to those that your man-god is directly speaking to at the time. When your man god says that one should 'turn the other cheek' or 'if someone takes your coat, give them your shirt too' or 'if someone takes your things do not try to get them back' or 'sell all your possessions and give the money to the poor', they are universal teaching showing what you have to do to be 'Christlike' or a good Christian. If that were not the case then Christians would be spending all their time wondering about what teaching applies to them, which applies to everyone and which applies only to the person Jesus is speaking to. Is the 'Sermon on the Mount' only meant for those that were being spoken to? Is [i]'Love your enemies and do good to those who hate you' only for those who were there being spoken to? Of course not! They are the teachings of your man-god which are meant to teach you how to be a good Christian.

Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
Many christians like to think they walk in the footsteps of jesus. How convenient that you've found a loophole.
Convenient indeed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
And we weren't called to "make a nuisance of ourselves". We were meant to lead by example in the name of God.
No. By your thinking, that would only be the disciples...because they were the ones he said it to...right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TroutDude View Post
In my opinion, it's a really silly notion all round.

It's absurd that an Omni-God Thing would make so many mistakes and then come up with this stupid, convoluted notion that his son - who is really himself, only different - has to pretend to commit suicide and then clamber back up into heaven on the 2nd or 3rd day (depending on which anonymous scripture writer you're reading) in order to make it easy for people who said the Magic Words To Jesus to go to heaven when they died, even if they were total knobs during their earthly sojourn.

You couldn't sell that premise to Fox TV today. And they'll show anything.

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Old Yesterday, 01:02 AM
 
10,620 posts, read 10,892,564 times
Reputation: 3227
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafius View Post
Complete and utter balderdash. The NT contains the 'teachings' of the Christian man-god Jesus. Those teachings are universal and meant for ALL of you to follow so that you be 'good Christians, not just to those that your man-god is directly speaking to at the time. When your man god says that one should 'turn the other cheek' or 'if someone takes your coat, give them your shirt too' or 'if someone takes your things do not try to get them back' or 'sell all your possessions and give the money to the poor', they are universal teaching showing what you have to do to be 'Christlike' or a good Christian. If that were not the case then Christians would be spending all their time wondering about what teaching applies to them, which applies to everyone and which applies only to the person Jesus is speaking to. Is the 'Sermon on the Mount' only meant for those that were being spoken to? Is [i]'Love your enemies and do good to those who hate you' only for those who were there being spoken to? Of course not! They are the teachings of your man-god which are meant to teach you how to be a good Christian.

Convenient indeed.

No. By your thinking, that would only be the disciples...because they were the ones he said it to...right?




Still can't rep you, Rafius.
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Old Yesterday, 02:20 AM
 
38,561 posts, read 25,971,477 times
Reputation: 5940
Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillobyte View Post
Still can't rep you, Rafius.
You and Rafe suffer from the same mistaken beliefs about God based on Fundamentalist premises.
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