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The "dirt" on the Founding Fathers requires no "digging".
Actually, as respects Religious Indoctrination of the Society....it has been all over it, ever since they ran their game.
Their conjob writings and rules to the contrary, notwithstanding.
That is the point I try to make...when someone makes the claim they did not like religion, or wanted the Country to be secular. Their actions proved different.
yeah, but everybody was religious back then. I think they would have ran things different today. They operated as free as they could under that system. I actually think they did a great job under the confines of society at that time. they are trying to lessen the affect of one religion deciding the rules. In a room full of religious people.
I think they were deist or pantheist myself. A lot of them were smart enough to understand that no biblegod existed but they really have no proof. When we don't have proof we can get all twisted up convoluted logic. Trans is an excellent of of convoluted logic. his twisted up notions having to answer to no-god and anti-religion is an excellent of convoluted twisted up logic supporting a less valid statement of belief.
The "dirt" on the Founding Fathers requires no "digging".
Actually, as respects Religious Indoctrination of the Society....it has been all over it, ever since they ran their game.
Their conjob writings and rules to the contrary, notwithstanding.
That is the point I try to make...when someone makes the claim they did not like religion, or wanted the Country to be secular. Their actions proved different.
I'm going to be a little more generous to the floundering fathers. They were imperfect men...just as you and I are. They worked in a world that was much different than ours, and with their own faults and foibles still tried to create a more perfect union. In some ways they succeeded, in other ways they failed...and we still haven't gotten it right since then.
The "dirt" on the Founding Fathers requires no "digging".
Actually, as respects Religious Indoctrination of the Society....it has been all over it, ever since they ran their game.
Their conjob writings and rules to the contrary, notwithstanding.
That is the point I try to make...when someone makes the claim they did not like religion, or wanted the Country to be secular. Their actions proved different.
Well, you really refute yourself here. You sideline what they wrote - their ideals in fact - and try to pretend that these were not their ideals because of their failings. That's what i mean by 'dirt -digging'.
Well, you really refute yourself here. You sideline what they wrote - their ideals in fact - and try to pretend that these were not their ideals because of their failings. That's what i mean by 'dirt -digging'.
What they wrote was cool...very.
How they acted and what they did was the opposite of what they wrote, and not just as regards Religion...but as regards many cool things they wrote.
Slavemaster, woman oppressing dudes, carrying out a genocide...saying and endorsing the declaration that all men are created equal. You don't get more hypocritical than that. Conmen...hungry for power, prestige, and the highlife...running a scam.
What they wrote was cool...very.
How they acted and what they did was the opposite of what they wrote, and not just as regards Religion...but as regards many cool things they wrote.
Slavemaster, woman oppressing dudes, carrying out a genocide...saying and endorsing the declaration that all men are created equal. You don't get more hypocritical than that. Conmen...hungry for power, prestige, and the highlife...running a scam.
At least you concede that what they wrote was cool. I also say that it is a very useful and convenient basis for separation of Church and state and the law to keep it that way. In return. I will concede that in themselves they were not plaster saints.
At least you concede that what they wrote was cool. I also say that it is a very useful and convenient basis for separation of Church and state and the law to keep it that way. In return. I will concede that in themselves they were not plaster saints.
Religion does not belong in government and governing...not at all, IMO.
The reason it is, and has always been, so prevalent in the U.S....is because of the actions of those so-called Founding Fathers. They instigated it...and saw to it that it was ingrained and locked in.
You can't judge late 18th Century people using 21st Century standards. You need to look at those people within the norms for that day and time.
True. There is an evolution to the intangibles of our humanity just as there is to our physical bodies. It can be as unfair to judge our lack of humanity in a specific area where we had not collectively evolved the sensitivity to it as it would be to judge our lack of upright bipedal walking before we evolved the appropriate pelvis.
You can't judge late 18th Century people using 21st Century standards. You need to look at those people within the norms for that day and time.
I didn't do that.
I was comparing what they wrote at the time (so, obviously they had "evolved" enough to know what was cool), to what they actually did at that same time.
I always note this in response to those that claim they were not into religion (didn't even like it), and wanted the nation they were assembling to be secular.
It's like someone giving you counsel that everyone should be honest...while they are picking your pocket. Based on what they are saying, they obviously are aware of the virtue of being above boards...but their actions are demonstrative of them being a scammer.
Once you know what they did...you would not say they "didn't like stealing", just because of what they were saying as they robbed you.
And you also wouldn't say they hadn't evolved to know being a thief was wrong.
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