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Old Yesterday, 12:54 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
Yeah, I'd stand with you on that, although I'm not sure I'll be here in 2050. I was born in '58, and while it appears that Mom will make it to 91 in November (and is inviting people to her 100th birthday party) I indulged in some habits earlier in life that may make my time on the planet a bit shorter than hers.

But my anarchist daughter will carry the torch for us!

P.S. You could probably put me comfortably in the "sortagoddists" room. I hear they have good beer.
I don't how long I have. I'm still looking for an afterlife that has designer cider. What's the sortagod bar like?
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Old Yesterday, 01:05 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
I agree that Trans is a black-and-white thinker, but there's room for that in my world of all the pretty colors. Black and white have their place.
Fair point. Speculation is fine and can pose some good questions, but (thinking back to my UFO days) there is value in keeping one foot on the carpet and applying the rules of logic, or the mind can cut loose and never come back. i have seen it.

That said, i don't see myself as black and white. Disbelief means that I don't invest in a faith, and that means I avoid "Believe This - dismiss anything else". I can change my mind in a flash if the evidence convinces me. It is Faith that is so hard to get to move with the evidence (rather they ignore it on some pretext). And while the argument: "this is either true or it isn't" is black and white enough, the woo -end of physics, cosmology and Quantum is enough to unseat the mind of a lot of people who appeal to unknowns but will not entertain the idea that our reality is made of nothing projected holographically from beyond the universe. But I can because reality is fine as reality, never mind what it's made of.

What I'm getting at is my 'concrete thinking' allows me to have a very flexible mind, whereas faith - based mindsets tend to be very inflexible. It may seem that I implacably 'reject' stuff, but that isn't it at all. The problem is that on a forum like this, 99% of the arguments made (by the the theist side, it has to be said) are going to fail at stage 1 - they are without valid evidential support or are un -logical or both.
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Old Yesterday, 01:39 PM
 
40,034 posts, read 26,715,004 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Arq, in spite of how many times that you misunderstand my views, I continue to be amazed at your consistency in doing so. You have to know that there is nothing magical about my views. I even had an entire thread denounce magical thinking. Boiling it down to the extreme, there is nothing BUT consciousness. We experience ours as a separate phenomenon because our experiences are delimited by our physical bodies. But there really is no such separation in consciousness. That would be the single most surprising aspect of my experience - retaining my individualness while being undeniably part of the ONE consciousness that defines and establishes our Reality.

Given this Reality, I would not exclude anyone's experiences based on our limited knowledge of how things work from the 5% we have investigated. That is what defines the difference between us, Arq. Pragmatically, I operate as you do under the assumption that things operate according to the "laws and processes" we have discovered. Philosophically, I am unfettered by such limitations since I know the immense power and unrestrained nature of our imaginations - God's imagination is why we exist so it must be so much more capable and anything is possible. Woo, Woo, Woo!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRANSPONDER View Post
It isn't that. The post was inviting response from you (or indeed Mystic) about this Experience. My point was that your Experience and Mystics appear to be the same thing, and is not unknown in other examples. I was just saying that I don't want another derail into Mystic's Pet Theory.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
My argument with you is that you have chosen to live a life bereft of imagination and connection with the rest of the creation, as well as not tapping into your own natural intuition, and my experiences would not allow me to live that way. I don't tell you that your way of life is wrong, but you don't get to tell me that my way of life is wrong, either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TRANSPONDER View Post
Ok. If you check back to the start of this discussion you'll see that I said that I took it as being the same as Mystics, and if it wasn't 9as you now say) then I just don't know what it is other than stepping on cracks in the pavement. Or is it Not stepping on cracks in the pavement. You can see that as significant, if you wish, and gives some sort of meaning in your life, but at least Mystic has a definite event that he bases his beliefs on - even though I question the interpretation.
<Snip>
It was you and the reference to woo suggested some kind of Mystical experience. And if not, then I can't see what.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
I know you can't, and I get that some people don't/can't/won't tap into that side of themselves, which is why you'll never see me trying to convince anyone of anything like that on here. It's OK. There are enough posters here doing that to keep you entertained.
Gldn accuses him of Godophobia, but I am beginning to think it is Woo-o-phobia.
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Old Yesterday, 05:05 PM
 
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how would a person with Arachnophobia talk about a spiders web?

remove spider and put religionphobia talking about god.

they are exactly the same.

but its me not understanding the anti-god sect.
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Old Today, 05:50 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Gldn accuses him of Godophobia, but I am beginning to think it is Woo-o-phobia.
If you ever read or understood posts, you'd know that I love Woo. What I don't love is using it as bathwater-muddying in order to claim there is a baby in there. Your '..phobia' ploy is palpable well -poisoning. Nobody is fooled by this.
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Old Today, 06:30 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRANSPONDER View Post
If you ever read or understood posts, you'd know that I love Woo. What I don't love is using it as bathwater-muddying in order to claim there is a baby in there. Your '..phobia' ploy is palpable well -poisoning. Nobody is fooled by this.
we understand totally, its you trying to openly deceive people.

what we understand is that pantheism sees little pieces of non life interacting to form the system we are in. It then says the whole system is formed by the same pieces interacting with each other.

that is a valid claim.

calling it wooo, sort-a-god, apologetic, semantics does not change the validity of that claim.

unless you can show that little pieces of the system are nt interacting to form "you", trans?

now, what we do understand is that you are trying to use "semantics" as evidence against that claim. well, trans, thats just nonsense.

yes, little pieces of the universe make up trans. The system that trans is in is vastly larger and more complex than trans. thats just a fact trans

you whole premise is "the word "GOD" has to much baggage so we shouldn't use that word."

thats fine, its even valid. but don't say gldie's data set is wrong. stay focused on how you don't like the word god, its a trigger for you.

be honest trans, ol' comrade.
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Old Today, 06:48 AM
 
13,450 posts, read 4,976,974 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
I agree that Trans is a black-and-white thinker, but there's room for that in my world of all the pretty colors. Black and white have their place.
yes, they do. this is a different conversation. and how i wish we all thought like you mighty.

I am addressing the black and thinker trying to define atheism.

I don't think that we should support people based on a statement of belief about god. we should support or confront people based on the evidence they are using.


without a bathroom a building will have trouble functioning.
But bathrooms do not define the building.
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Old Today, 06:57 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRANSPONDER View Post
Well, that's true enough. My Beef (and i have one) is with organized religions rather than with religion as such. But occasionally some claim is posted for something more abstract, like First cause, or argument from ID/Complexity, or personal experience of the divine. Silence gives assent and so it is almost axiomatic that a posted assertion is a claim and one either opposes it or agrees with it. It isn't personal, nor always part of the atheist agenda, which isn't picking fights with sortagoddists or believers in deistgod, but simple world domination by 2050 and deportation of all Christians and Trump - voters to the Gulag in Alaska (the one with 'deconvert or die' in wrought iron over the gate).
why let a beef with organized religion bleed all over a discussion on the properties of the god thing they claim?

they are two different conversations.

first cause is not a reason to believe in or not believe in god
personal experiences can be crossed checked. Personal experience is not the final say.
ID vs formed by the biosphere are not part of the "over organized religion is can be dangerous" conversation.

why do you intertwine them as if they are same thing?

" ... all trump voters and Christians should be locked up..." is the problem I have with you.

You can't separate your emotion form the nasty's and beautiful parts of the universe. You can't separate how you want it to be from how it is.

we all have to wipe ourself. if their is a god, it does too.

do you see how that is different than anti-god?
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