The reason the Bible has endured (Mormon, God, Christians, believe)
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Nothing like teaming up with Chuck Colson...a notorious "truth teller".
Hi phetaroi. I was unaware he had teamed up with Chuck Colson. Thanks for telling me, but what is it you're implying? Is Colson a liar? I know his name in relation to his prison ministry. Not sure what you're getting at. Do you?
The Bible is a record of the assumptions concerning reality made by our ignorant ancestors. It wasn't their fault. Knowledge grows from knowledge. The process takes time. The "truth" of the Bible has now been revealed to be little more than a record of ancient ignorance. In the future the Bible will be valued as a source for understanding our ignorant origins. Not for any inherent truth that it might hold.
Well, this is an open-minded perspective. Not! "There are more things in heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy [science]."
Do you find yourself unable to put your "evidences" into your own words? I asked for six such "evidences" to begin our discussion with. If that is that too difficult, then it must not be much of an argument.
Well, this is an open-minded perspective. Not! "There are more things in heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy [science]."
"There are more things in heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy." This is a quote from Hamlet, written by Shakespeare sometime around the beginning of the 17th century. There were certainly MANY more things in heaven and earth than Shakespeare could have dreamed of in the 17th century! But time marches on.
We are now in the 21st century, and we now have a great deal of observation based knowledge that Shakespeare could scarcely have dreamed of in his day. Does that mean we have everything all figured out? Certainly not! But we have discovered enough to know that making progress in the goal of attaining knowledge does NOT involve making the stuff up as we go along. As it so often turns out, observation based information is much more interesting than anything we might have conjured up in our imaginations anyway.
I am here aren't I! Have I "made (a) concerted effort to find truth?" Well, I was raised Christian and I have read the Bible cover to cover. That should be considered a good start. At least from your point of view.
Hi Nonsense. Yes, I do respect you for having read the entire Bible. I do think that indicates an openness and a genuine effort to evaluate. I'm currently in the process of reading the whole Bible for the first time.
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According to the Gospel According to Matthew, Jesus tasked Christians (that includes you presumably ) with spreading the "truth" of the Gospel. This is a forum dedicated to discussing religious beliefs. You have a specific set of religious beliefs. I am offering you the opportunity to state and defend those religious beliefs. So what's holding you back? Do you find yourself questioning your own beliefs?
I am aware of my responsibility to spread the "truth" of the Gospel, and I am happy to do that with anyone who is genuinely interested in an answer. The verse in Matthew that you quoted earlier does say what you're claiming, but it doesn't tell the whole story. There are occasions when doing that is not required of me. The verse I would quote to address your question would be construed as an insult if I quoted it, so I'll just tell you what verse it is (Matthew 7:6). This verse indicates that there's no obligation to spread the truth to those who mock or ridicule.
Even your comment was not absent unnecessarily insults, but I forgive you.
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Then this forum is a good place to test out your conclusions. Are you afraid that your ability to defend your beliefs might be shown to be inadequate? Then your choice is either to engage and learn, or to protect your precious but inadequately worked out conclusions by running and hiding.
The choices are yours to freely choose.
I'm not sure why you see this forum as the place to 'test out my conclusions'. I've already come to my conclusions. That was the whole point of my search for truth. Why would I need to test them out on this forum? Do you think there are arguments I haven't encountered before?
I'm not averse to answering any questions, as long as we can go about it with civility and without insults. (I'm not assuming you're incapable of that.)
Hi phetaroi. I was unaware he had teamed up with Chuck Colson. Thanks for telling me, but what is it you're implying? Is Colson a liar? I know his name in relation to his prison ministry. Not sure what you're getting at. Do you?
Ever hear of Watergate? He was known as "Richard Nixon's Hatchet Man".
"There are more things in heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy." This is a quote from Hamlet, written by Shakespeare sometime around the beginning of the 17th century. There were certainly MANY more things in heaven and earth than Shakespeare could have dreamed of in the 17th century! But time marches on.
We are now in the 21st century, and we now have a great deal of observation-based knowledge that Shakespeare could scarcely have dreamed of in his day. Does that mean we have everything all figured out? Certainly not! But we have discovered enough to know that making progress in the goal of attaining knowledge does NOT involve making the stuff up as we go along. As it so often turns out, observation-based information is much more interesting than anything we might have conjured up in our imaginations anyway.
That is true for the amount of knowledge you are probably currently aware of. However, the recent findings in many fields have removed the supports from under the reductionist materialist philosophy derived from empirical science and pose serious questions about the nature and composition of our Reality.
Does it mean anything to you that he was saved AFTER the Watergate scandal?
Are you aware of the prison ministries which he started?
Are you deliberately being deceitful, ignorant, or just another liar who doesn't care about Colson one way or the other?
1. No it doesn't mean a thing to me. I don't trust a felon. I agree they should have all their rights restored after their sentence is served. But I don't trust them.
2. Yes, I am aware of the prison ministries he started. He certainly belonged in such a group.
3. I condemn every felon for the crimes they committed, but want their rights restored after their imprisonment. They are not people to be admired.
First of all, which Bible are you talking about? The Bible was not even in English until the 16th century. There are many versions of the Bible, each with differences, so which of those is the "truth" and which is not?
At any rate, the endurance is not the Bible, but Christianity. It has endured largely because people were ignorant and easily spooked with stories of going to hell if they don't do what the church tells them to do. That and equally absurd tales of dying and then getting to hang around with all of your dead friends and relatives for eternity. People eat that stuff up but not because it is the truth but because they are indoctrinated from a young age and it is so deeply ingrained they cannot tell the difference between that and the truth. This is not unique to Christianity - all religions do the same thing.
I have had Christians, your normal garden variety, comment to me that Mormons are a bunch of kooks because they believe that Joseph Smith met with an angel that gave him sacred instructions engraved on a gold tablet in the woods of Vermont. It is ironic because that story is no more absurd than the one about the resurrection of Jesus. This just shows how indoctrinated people become - to them such nonsense is the truth.
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) with spreading the "truth" of the Gospel. This is a forum dedicated to discussing religious beliefs. You have a specific set of religious beliefs. I am offering you the opportunity to state and defend those religious beliefs. So what's holding you back? Do you find yourself questioning your own beliefs?
