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Do you believe there are several perfect paths to attain self-realization, besides be connecting to god through Jesus?
You misunderstand. What Jesus accomplished is structural and completely disconnected from any beliefs. ALL of human consciousness is now structurally connected to God's consciousness because of Christ's achievement. That is why He's the way to God, not because you need to be a Christian. It doesn't matter what you are. We are ALL connected to God thanks to His achievement.
So in your thinking a person must or should endure what Christ did to attain a perfect enlightenment? Just trying to follow.
I have never heard this line of thought. Is this unique to you or do others say this, also?
Really just curious, it is new to me.
Personally, as some don't say 'God' because of conflicting connotations, I never say 'enlightenment'. Ha!
It's clear that Mystic's line is that anything that isn't like the Christian doctrines (as interpreted by him) are not as good. And that's a fair argument. I tend to argue that Buddhism beats Christian doctrine, but other could argue that the emphasis on Love, Charity and giving is better than the emphasis on personal effort.
Personally a method of personal effort appeals better than relying on Faith to have JesusGod do everything for you. But that's just me. I see a rational doctrine rather than a faith -based one as superior.
You misunderstand. What Jesus accomplished is structural and completely disconnected from any beliefs. ALL of human consciousness is now structurally connected to God's consciousness because of Christ's achievement. That is why He's the way to God, not because you need to be a Christian. It doesn't matter what you are. We are ALL connected to God thanks to His achievement.
What you are saying is no different from what every Christian evangelist bent on conversion says, come to Jesus or be eternally damned. What you are doing is changing the language in some mystical ways that is not quite working either. You are borrowing that language from Buddhism and Advaita.
Each one of us have to do the same striving that Jesus did. That can only come from realizing the unreality of this world and experience the true reality of the universal consciousnesses which is only one. Nobody else, not Jesus, not Buddha, nobody can do it for us as it needs to be experienced individually to understand. And that is Self-realization. Each one of us have the same potential and capacity as Jesus did to realize whatever it is he did.
He may be the only way to God for you and others who believe as you do, nobody else, and if that is what you are also saying then yes, you are right. I just wish you all dont insist on damnation for the rest of us, that is not very loving.
What you are saying is no different from what every Christian evangelist bent on conversion says, come to Jesus or be eternally damned. What you are doing is changing the language in some mystical ways that is not quite working either. You are borrowing that language from Buddhism and Advaita.
Each one of us have to do the same striving that Jesus did. That can only come from realizing the unreality of this world and experience the true reality of the universal consciousnesses which is only one. Nobody else, not Jesus, not Buddha, nobody can do it for us as it needs to be experienced individually to understand. And that is Self-realization. Each one of us have the same potential and capacity as Jesus did to realize whatever it is he did.
He may be the only way to God for you and others who believe as you do, nobody else, and if that is what you are also saying then yes, you are right. I just wish you all dont insist on damnation for the rest of us, that is not very loving.
That's a weird thing to say. Mystic has never insisted on damnation for anyone. As a matter of fact, he is one of those who speak out strongly against that concept.
Do you believe there are several perfect paths to attain self-realization, besides be connecting to God through Jesus?
Being connected to God through Jesus is unavoidable but, Yes, we all have our own paths to God on that foundation laid by Christ.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008
Why do you think it is important for you to establish, through your own experience or revelation, that the only true way to God is through Christ, a human being in a mortal body?
Does your vision of perfect love embrace the idea that each will find his way to self-realization?
Because that is who we are, Spirit beings in human bodies. We all have to find our way because we are independent Spirit beings who must mature and are responsible for our achievements. The Good News is that the connection to God has been made for ALL human beings so we do not have to concern ourselves with perfection.
That's a weird thing to say. Mystic has never insisted on damnation for anyone. As a matter of fact, he is one of those who speak out strongly against that concept.
Which brings us back to topic. Sorta. The point of the Eden story as interpreted by Christianity is that we are all going to burn unless we become Christians. That's the long and short of it, and all the tosh abouit Love and compassion is so much eyewash. In fact those who sideline the whole problem of Evil and say 'Turn or burn and morals is beside the point' are being more honest than those who try to make Biblegod look good from the point of view of human ethics.
While (of course) I get on better with the Christins (like Mystic) who reject hellthreat, it does totally remove the stick that religions really need to drive the sheeple into the fane.
That's a weird thing to say. Mystic has never insisted on damnation for anyone. As a matter of fact, he is one of those who speak out strongly against that concept.
Well I am confused as well. If he says Jesus has created a pathway to god, which is available to you if you accept Jesus as your savior, then what happens to those who do not?. Who are Christians if not those who take Christ as their savior? Those christians also believe everyone else is damned. If that is not so what is the reason to believe in saviorism?
If there is only onwe pathway to god created by jesus, others are damned.
Being connected to God through Jesus is unavoidable but, Yes, we all have our own paths to God on that foundation laid by Christ.
Because that is who we are, Spirit beings in human bodies. We all have to find our way because we are independent Spirit beings who must mature and are responsible for our achievements. The Good News is that the connection to God has been made for ALL human beings so we do not have to concern ourselves with perfection.
What of those who have never heard of Jesus, and so didnt get the news? Millions and billions and trillions of souls before Jesus was conceived?
I would change that to "If you focus on self you are up the creek."
No deity god needed.
There are armies of self-help gurus that would disagree with that.
Anyways....it's all hypothetical. The Fruit of the Tree: Knowledge; Awareness; Cognizance; Awakening.
The Creator said "Don't do it." Eve said "Let's do it." Adam said "OK." Creator said "Get out!"
What of those who have never heard of Jesus, and so didnt get the news? Millions and billions and trillions of souls before Jesus was conceived?
That IS the Good News! They don't have to concern themselves about it no matter who they have or have not heard about. When they love they know God. I am not trying to annoy you with verses but they capture the essence of the God I encountered which is why I adopt them.
1 John 4:7-8 Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. 8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.
1 John 3:18 Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth.
These are such perfect verses for highlighting the importance of ACTIONS. It also highlights the meaning of "born of God" that is confused with "born again" (anagennaō) or "born from above" (gennaō anōthen). "Born of God" is gennaō ek theos or "begotten of God" . . . which means "to be conceived by God" . . . as a spiritual embryo. Embryos must mature sufficiently to be born. It is our actions in "love of God and each other" through our lives that achieve that spiritual maturation and determines what we have "built upon the foundation of Jesus"(wood, hay, stubble or gold, silver, etc.)This spiritual insemination (conception) is what those who call themselves "born again" while still in the flesh are actually referring to but don't seem to realize it.
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As a matter of fact, he is one of those who speak out strongly against that concept.
