U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 08-31-2008, 06:22 PM
 
17 posts, read 54,310 times
Reputation: 17

Advertisements

Yes, I'm one of them, just can't make up my mind and for years now I've been trying to come to a conclusion and the only conclusion I've found is that there is only one conclusion to come to. There just isn't enough evidence on either side for me to make up my mind. So I'm an agnostic, and as much as I'd like to have a more definite answer to the big question, this is the best I've got. Although it is appealing to have a friend up in the sky who cares about your problems, and as much as I wish it was true, it just seems...Moderator cut: deletion it's starting to become incoherent... but, how about you guys? Anyone have a delimma of being agnostic but wanting to have a firmer belief?

Last edited by june 7th; 08-31-2008 at 06:51 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 08-31-2008, 07:20 PM
 
428 posts, read 1,477,202 times
Reputation: 282
Do you mean, a firmer belief, or a firmer non-belief? On some occasions I've probably wished to be a believer, but it's truly no different than a wish to have a fairy godmother. It's comforting to think someone is "up there" watching over you. (After all, it was the most comforting thing in the world to have your mother hold you and make you feel better when you fell down as a child.) And it's comforting to think you're going to go somewhere wonderful when you die instead of just being nonexistent. So why wouldn't anyone wish it were true?

But...I've discovered (as have all the other agnostics/atheists) that it's impossible to make yourself believe something when you have no evidence for it being true.

As for wishing I were a stronger non-believer--no, that doesn't bother me at all. I am agnostic, meaning I don't think God can ever be proven to exist. I lean toward atheism, as do most agnostics. It is not fence-sitting, though; it is a position I am satisfied with based on what I know to be true at this time.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-31-2008, 10:15 PM
 
17 posts, read 54,310 times
Reputation: 17
Towards the belief side, because I really do enjoy the comfort of religion.

"But...I've discovered (as have all the other agnostics/atheists) that it's impossible to make yourself believe something when you have no evidence for it being true."

Yep, tried that, the lack of evidence really keeps me from joining the ranks of believers. One of the reasons I came to the forum is to see what other people have done to reconcile themselves on what degree of belief they've come to have, however slight, in a creator.

I didn't go to the Christian area because I didn't want to get, "just read the bible and meditate on it" or "ask God to speak to you when you read scripture." (using examples of what people have told me elsewhere) I'd just like the open frankness that I've seen in this forum.

I'd really like to have some evidence, but I've searched for a long time and it just isn't there. The only 'evidence' I've found is anecdotal, which isn't really withstanding for me.

So, i'm a little tired and not sure where I'm going with this now... hmm maybe this would be a bit more objective...

Why do you, mozart, or anyone else think that this longing for a belief in a creator is so pervasive with so many people *myself included*? Is it because we have a desire to explain the unexplainable, or something else?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-01-2008, 06:16 AM
 
428 posts, read 1,477,202 times
Reputation: 282
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsycAnima View Post
Why do you, mozart, or anyone else think that this longing for a belief in a creator is so pervasive with so many people *myself included*? Is it because we have a desire to explain the unexplainable, or something else?
Partly. We humans have been trying to explain phenomena since time immemorial. But I tend to think the longing for belief is more of a response to a deep fear and insecurity we have. I mean, we are probably the only species who understand that we will die (other animals have some concept--i.e., elephants and their "graveyards", etc--but I'm talking about knowledge enough to have a lifetime fear of oblivion). And after all, life was extremely hard in the days that religions were being developed out of tribal belief systems. So we had to invent something to make that life more bearable. It's certainly possible that we have some genetic tendency to believe in something, because it may have conferred an advantage at some point in our history.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-01-2008, 11:06 AM
 
Location: Boise
2,006 posts, read 2,878,803 times
Reputation: 721
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsycAnima View Post
Yes, I'm one of them, just can't make up my mind and for years now I've been trying to come to a conclusion and the only conclusion I've found is that there is only one conclusion to come to. There just isn't enough evidence on either side for me to make up my mind. So I'm an agnostic, and as much as I'd like to have a more definite answer to the big question, this is the best I've got. Although it is appealing to have a friend up in the sky who cares about your problems, and as much as I wish it was true, it just seems...Moderator cut: deletion it's starting to become incoherent... but, how about you guys? Anyone have a delimma of being agnostic but wanting to have a firmer belief?
For me agnostic was a transition. I started out as a good little church goer, then I thouhgt about it for a while and now I am pretty much Atheist. I don't deny that there might be a higher power, cause I'm just a human and I really don't know, and I probably won't either. So I can't rule it out. But as far as it being the god that we think of now, I think a lot of that is a figment of our imagination.

I used to want a firm belief, but the more I looked at humanity and history, the less I wanted to do with religion.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-01-2008, 11:17 AM
 
Location: Pikeville, Ky.
13,435 posts, read 20,999,859 times
Reputation: 17534
PsycAnima, my son is agnostic..As long as my h and his family keep pressuring him to come join their legalistic church, I believe he will stay agnostic or decide to be atheist..If you were to ask my opinion I would just say, maybe you are looking for evidence from men and their wisdom, instead of looking within yourself, and trying to find what is urging you to seek a belief..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-01-2008, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Nashville, Tn
7,916 posts, read 16,244,006 times
Reputation: 5440
I can completely understand how someone could be agnostic. I went through a period in my late teens and early twenties when I identified more as an agnostic than an atheist but eventually I felt I belonged in the atheist category and have felt that way ever since. I think Blue makes a good point, this is something you can't learn from someone else, it really has to be your own thinking and has to feel right. There are many people who remain agnostic all their lives because they don't feel there is enough information to make a clear choice and there's nothing wrong with that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-01-2008, 05:17 PM
 
17 posts, read 54,310 times
Reputation: 17
Well I'm still in my early 20s so it's not like I've been thinking about this for a long time. If I ever do chose to go with atheism or a deistic belief (probably Christian because I can identify more with this one) it will be based not on evidence but on how I really feel about it. For me, agnosticism, at least in my case, feels like a transition period. I guess I'll just see how this pans out.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-01-2008, 05:59 PM
 
Location: Kentucky
1,090 posts, read 1,937,804 times
Reputation: 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsycAnima View Post
Why do you, mozart, or anyone else think that this longing for a belief in a creator is so pervasive with so many people *myself included*? Is it because we have a desire to explain the unexplainable, or something else?
I'm not mozart, but I'll jump in on this here... and I'll be honest about it when I do it. I think the longing for a belief for alot of people is not so much an internal need for a creator so much as it is the lingering remnants from indoctrination that we receive when we're young. Our early years are the most formative of our life. And these are often the years in which the concept of a creator and religion are introduced.

The existance of a creator is something that is as ingrained in many of us as the color of the sky. Though sometimes we see that the sky is gray (on a cloudy day) or orange (during sunset), we always say the sky is blue. Belief, for some people, is kind of the same thing. A person may see that there's evidence pointing to there not being a creator (or creators), but they've been told so long that one is there that they let what they've been taught trump what they may see.

Or at least, that's my take on it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-03-2008, 05:45 PM
 
Location: home...finally, home .
8,159 posts, read 17,833,452 times
Reputation: 17521
Then, you would probably enjoy Bill Maher's new movie.


YouTube - Bill Maher on Religion
__________________
******************


People may not recall what you said to them, but they will always remember how you made them feel .
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2017, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top