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Hi again everyone and welcome back @Violet11 - thank for your making those clarifications to @Still_Chealaing, yes - I too wondered what that reference to AnonChick was all about ??? - does Still_Chealaing know you from "a past life" or something :-) another forum somewhere perhaps...?
I realized soon after creating the peacemaker21 ID - on the day President Obama was awarded his Nobel Prize (thus the inspiration for my moniker) that yes: it's not always possible to be a "peacemaker" nor a "wall-breaker" (in context of my previous post regarding which side of the wall we choose to sit":
Quote:
"We see what we see, stand where we stand, and do what we do, but there ain't no movin' a fixed point of view"
I might even be called a "FenceSitter" - does that make my provisional faith any the weaker in the presence of "FaithShakers" or "FaithBoosters" I wonder? :-) Only time will tell, as the truth will out....
Out of interest @Violet11: have you had a chance to read the Intro to MP book in its entireity yet? If so, I'm curious to hear how it settled with you. @EOF and you are both right: I tend to give my responses here in the form of quotes from various MP writings such as Dennis Holtje's book "From Light to Sound" or the 2002-MP-website, as I often find that these express what I have experienced and am trying to convey, better than my attempts at using my own words (although I tried this too e.g. with my "elated, sparkling mind" descriptions etc).
I agree with your remark to Still_Chealaing that there's a courtesy involved in being a new poster on a thread: to come "up-to-speed" with the history and flow of the conversation thusfar, before passing judgement on others, but each will be moved by their own perceptions, emotions and thoughts: it's not for me to say what posters should or shouldn't say (that's the moderator's job - as @Still_Kicking found out when one of his posts locked up the thread for a bit!) so @Still_Chealaing: equally, it would be interesting to hear what you make of this thread in its entirety once you have had a chance to read it, or at least the gist of it.
That said, the original question from Shuffler is "...anybody familiar?" so I'm sure that as time goes on, there will be the occasional passer-by MP chela etc like @Richard. who chose to respond only to the initial question, share their experience, then be on their way without wishing to become involved in the on-going dialogue.
My own approach in trying to get up to speed with the then 70+ pages of the thread in Oct-2009 when I joined, was to draw up my various lists of active posters, and what their connection with MP or related people was - as I thought this would help me and future visitors to the thread to quickly get a grasp of what was happening.
Yes, so many words have been written - over 1000 posts now and rising - and whyso? - If it were a simple case of guillable and/or vulnerable spiritual seekers being robbed by a con-man, the debate would have been quite black and white and evident on this thread by now - the fact that ex-chelas like Still_Kicking and End_of_Faith, and current chelas such as myself and Still_Chealaing (until otherwise proven, I'm assuming he is a unique individual separate in mind and body from Allan1015) are still discussing the shades of grey of our inner and outer experiences, and what the source of these really could be...was what prompted me to say:
Quote:
If the principles themselves as propounded in MP turned out to be false, I would raise my hand and say, "yup, this was one hell of a sophisticated scam and I was duped".
Furthermore, it seems the discussion here has widened beyond MP and RS to the whole idea of satgurus throughout the history of the Light and Sound teachings and just what their involvement (if any) is with the inner experiences of their students - It would truly be an epic scam to have been perpetuated for so long (millenia) upon so many, if there never were a need for any of those gurus over history - do the doubters on this thread, doubt the need for gurus in general, i.e. doubt the validity of all Masters? - or is there still hope that such a being as a genuine Master / Saint / Sat Guru (Someone who has totally mastered his own consciousness and can teach others to master their own) actually exists?
Having an interest in parapsychology and as a Truth-seeker, I do genuinely want to get to the bottom of what is going on in my mind at its various levels (conscious, subconscious and un/superconscious), and in everyone else's too - in terms of mentality: what's the mindset of a chela, an ex-chela, a seeker, a relative of a chela etc...and of those, now and in the past, who have posited themselves as satgurus? - I think the end result of sharing on a thread such as this can only be win-win for everyone - As I've said before, personally I wouldn't still be involved with MP were I not getting value from it - at the moment I'm trying to reconcile my positive, consciousness-expanding experiences with the things that have been written here, to try to understand where we're all coming from, and what can happen when good intentions (e.g. in students who later go on to become gurus) go south.
To that end, the promised links - yet more reading material...and catching up on some recent questions...coming right up...
Last edited by PeaceMaker21; 01-20-2010 at 11:26 AM..
Hi again everyone and welcome back @Violet11 - thank for your making those clarifications to @Still_Chealaing, yes - I too wondered what that reference to AnonChick was all about ??? - does Still_Chealaing know you from "a past life" or something :-) another forum somewhere perhaps...?
Evidently he thinks he knows me from somewhere, but I can assure you I've never heard the name "AnonChick" until this morning.
Since I didn't find anyone named AnonChick searching City Data, I googled "AnonChick" and "MasterPath" in an attempt to decipher "Still_Chealaing"'s cryptic mention, and found a message board containing some MP posts from a few years ago.
And what do you know? Our very own Allan was posting on that board about MP too! Along with someone called AnonChick, who he apparently thinks is me? Interesting reading actually, I'm grateful to him for leading me to the thread. There were some real whackadoodles over there.
Skimming through a handful of the bazillion posts by AnonChick there (using a thread search), I found that she appears not to buy into what some pretentious kooks posted about MP, and I don't think she was ever a chela. But that's where the similarities end. In one post I saw, she said she was 24 (I'm in my mid-30's) and in another I think she stated she was Jewish with a Slovak background (I'm Swedish and was raised Protestant).
No matter though, the point is I've never used that moniker. I've never actually posted on ANY message board before this one, and have stated that here before. Does Allan a.k.a. Still_Chealaing think there couldn't possibly be more than one non-chela who is female and opposed to MasterPath?
Can't seem to shutup today, sorry! But Peacemaker, I just wanted to respond to a couple more topics you asked about in your last post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeaceMaker21
I might even be called a "FenceSitter" - does that make my provisional faith any the weaker in the presence of "FaithShakers" or "FaithBoosters" I wonder? :-) Only time will tell, as the truth will out....
Out of interest @Violet11: have you had a chance to read the Intro to MP book in its entireity yet?
Most of it. No offense, but it's mostly comedy to me. In the interest of fairness though, there are some universal concepts about karma, souls, etc. that I would generally agree with. But nothing that I haven't already read/heard elsewhere and contemplated before.
In response to your comments about gurus though (light and sound or otherwise) and whether they have all just been scammers throughout history - I think this has been discussed here briefly before.
Speaking for myself (never having been a chela as you know), I view it in simple terms: yes, there've been wise souls throughout history who were perhaps more in touch with "God" and their own spirituality. Some learned through others, and maybe some had spiritual experiences that inspired them to teach and empower others, just like you said. Some of these people might have been referred to as "gurus". Some Sunday School teachers, some rabbis, some just your average Joe Schmoe.
I've always welcomed the opportunity to learn what others perceive about "God", to gain a deeper understanding of the world through them...regardless of their spiritual "title" or lack of one!
So I don't begrudge anyone for wanting to teach and help others find something divine within themselves. In that sense, there would be no real "scam" perpetrated by someone sharing their wisdom and understanding with willing listeners.
We could all probably agree though, that there have always been "gurus" just in it for the glory, who make fantastical claims about themselves.
And nowadays, spirituality is a business. That's pretty universal, but when mandatory "dues" are involved in order to continue on the path to "God", it starts getting even more sketchy.
Then, MasterPath separates itself even further from most organized religion and New Age quackery by presenting "Sri Gary Olsen" as an elevated figure, a godman, the true channel, a man whose image is glorified...and a man who has demonstrated dishonesty and a lack of ethics, a man who tells his followers that their dues and donations to him/his group can absolve their karma! And on and on and on.
So no, I personally don't think there is a magic man, a genuine "master", a true "saint" out there. Not in the way I think you mean. But if there is, he's not collecting money for his "non-profit" organization. And he's not behaving like Gary Olsen.
Violet - thanks for clarifying on "AnonChick" point and sharing your insights on reading the MP intro book - IMHO you do strike me as a genuine seeker of truth and I truly wish you and all the others on this thread the best in finding what matters most to you in heart and soul. In the spirit of provisional faith, I'm keeping an open mind and waiting to see how the story unfolds on this thread. A lot has been written recently, and I've still got many posts to catch up on, so for now I'm not in @PointMaker or @ReplyWriter mode :-) just sharing some links and documents that I have compiled together that I didn't have time to post yesterday.
As mentioned, the 1966 RS Book "Audiences with the Master (Charan Singh) in America" arrived in the post (I found a copy for sale on Amazon).
(I post these scans from it in a spirit of fair-use via eSnips - but if anyone from RSSB wants me to remove the files, I am happy to do so).
I took the liberty of scanning chapter 02 - A full transcript of Charan Singh-Ji's 1964 interview with the Minneapolis TV journalist:
- (e-Snips recently changed the way they handle downloads, so excuse the ads on this one - the download link is still available from the page).
Chapter 13 describes in great detail the different kinds of karma and what happens to souls after they exit the physical plane. @EOF, thanks for sharing those quotes - I was also intrigued by your statement that you're "not scared of death" - would you care to elaborate (here or on DM) why that is? I had an inner experience was I was 21, a year before becoming a chela which removed my fear of death itself (though when the day arrives, I would still prefer quick and painless rather than prolonged and agonizing...that choice too has apparently been predetermined by our karma - hence my pondering, "how free are we?"
There's quite a comprehensive list of the various Light and Sound paths in the world, here:
I did skim-read "The Unknowing Sage" to get its gist (will read more fully later) - but there is also a summarized account of the life of Baba Faqir Chand in the context of RadhaSoami on a website, written by a former Eckankar chela, Johnson Ford on:
Quick response to @EOF regarding Eckankar / MP: (answering a quote with a quote from the MP website 2002 Q+A):
Quote:
Originally Posted by end_of_faith
I watched the first few minutes.... right up to the point of the "972nd master" part....
Does this make Gary the "973rd master" in Eckankar's imaginary lineage? And would Joy be the 974th, and Dennis the 975th....?
Quote:
Another distinction is that MasterPath recognizes the past Masters of the Light and Sound traditions, including Rumi, Kabir, Guru Nanak, Tulsi Sahib, Seth Shiv Dayal Singh, and the many other Saints and Masters who followed or preceded them.
Eckankar, on the other hand, teaches the lineage of the Order of the Vairagi/Bourchakhoum masters, ascended masters that include Rebazar Tarzs, Fubbi Quantz, Gopal Das, Yaubl Sacabi, Rami Nuri, and Sudar Singh, along with dozens of others. These ascended masters, as stated by Eckankar, teach students on the inner planes, in a series of locations known as the Golden Wisdom Temples.
This distinction is noteworthy, because wisdom temples of this nature and this line of masters (the Vairagi) do not exist in the traditional doctrine of Surat Shabda Yoga, nor the MasterPath teachings. Shabda Yoga teaches the primacy of the living Master/student relationship. Only living Masters have the role of teaching in MasterPath and in Surat Shabda Yoga. The works of ascended Masters are certainly cherished and studied, but the only case in which a student has a direct relationship with a deceased Master is if this very Master previously initiated the student in the physical world while that Master was still living.
The last line is interesting in the current thread's context of narcissism because as chelas, if we are initiated by Sri Gary, even after his death, it will be his inner form (Garji) that we look for - not the form of the next leader of MP.
On a slightly related note (as I think some mention of Post-Traumatic Stress-Disorder has been made on this thread) there was a recent scientific discovery reported, involving the measurement of magnetic fields in the brain to detect PTSD:
What a lame experience if death is dictated and predetermined by karma, there really would be no freedom as you say PM21. Packaged up in a path with crows, swans, orange lakes and crooked tunnels. Mired in ritual, dogma, and spiritual personality. Whatever happened to the NOW? Masterpath is a path, like any other path. They all purport the way to salvation or realization. They are all the highest and the way home. They are all mechanisms that help us to feel safe, special and loved. I remember a Masterpath poster that compared itself to Conventional religions.....if you break it down and take a 360, there is really not that much difference between the two. Masterpath is ripe with rules, fees and hipocracy. Gary may not take all your money or ask you to take your life but he has ensnared his students in a cult of personality and borrowed teachings. He , Joy and Dennis are crafty wielders of deceit, fraud and false humilty. i.e. "I am Dogmeat"
There may be some beautiful truths in the masterpath teachings but I am here to tell you that Gary does not have the corner on the market. In fact there is no difference between masterpath or any other esoteric teaching except the fact that you have to look for His face on the inner, and you can eat meat, and smoke a little weed, and read instead of meditate. Please.
Did you know that Gary had the ushers count every chela in every seat when the online nametags were unveiled? He wanted to make sure that the numbers were matching up with registration and people were not copying nametags and getting in free. Does that sound like a spiritual teacher not interested in money? Seems a little self willed and control freaky huh? Also, I remeber a meeting where we were filming for a seeker video and the chelas were ushered into certain areas to give the "appearance" of being a full house so that the video would look good. GIVE ME A BREAK! Whatever happened to being earmarked for the Master? What a dog and pony show. It is so contrived.
If you really take the time to look objectively at the Masterpath , there is way too much poop for it to be what it purports. The poop goes on and on. I doubt seriously if there is a pony in that pile. For me, the pony has been reclaiming myself from the biggest load of crap I have fallen for in this life. I am so grateful to have left Masterpath after 16 years. My life has never been better. Truly.
I am not afraid of Gary or his procalamations that I "will suffer many lifetimes of pain and heartache for leaving the outer Master prematurely" ( dues dues dues....) What a fear tactic.
Its knda like finding out that the Council of Nicea deleted most of the books written in the Bible. Being a conscious and intelligent person, I have to take that fact into account and will either rationalize myself to stay or move on. My previous posts on this thread are ripe with Councils of Nicea within the Masterpath. I had to go. Some will stay, and I will think of them like I do my Christian mother.... It is serving her at this time and every grade, 1-12 has value, even if it is deceitful or untrue. It is all relative truth. ( Sounds familiar huh?). ..soul and mind are knotted together....dont check your mind at the door.
PM21, How long is provisional faith okay? Gary says by the time you take the second that process should be vetted. Two years of investigation and then you take the binding initiation.
You've been on the path too long to be riding the fence. As Gary says, you have to go for broke. Give it your all. It is a waring universe. There is no Peace. You have to want him like you want air. there is no skirting around the outer master.
To those that have not been chelas, I apologize for relating my views with a lot of MP phraseolgy.
Yupp it would be a pretty lame experience if life (and death) were totally predetermined - I do believe we have some free-will, (or at least we have no choice but to act as if we do), and we can only try our best to "influence the outcome" of our lives.
As you mentioned earlier in reference to the death of your friend, Doug, even if SGO had spoken on stage about his murder (and who knows, he may yet...), without presuming, it most likely will be along the lines of "karma, karma, karma" - I've got no agenda other than getting to the truth, and I don't mean to come across as "pushing" MP on anyone reading here, hence what I meant earlier about sharing links "from all sides" and sources, including the Radha scans.
Am repeating the links here as they garbled last post - available on eSnips / best viewed full-screen in Scribd, or can be downloaded as PDF and cut-and-pastable text:
IMO Chapter 13 is worth reading in its entirety - Charan's style is pretty direct, no punches pulled - but don't have to listen to me: I'm not a wannabe-guru or teacher, just a fellow student in this here school of life, discussing the syllabus in the schoolyard wit me classmates, learning what's what, as some look on and others chip in.
Quote:
417 Q. Maharaj Ji. if a soul's life is very short in this birth would it return again? Why is it that life was cut short? Their karmic debt must have been very light. but does that mean that they have been initiated already and will not return any more, or will they have to come back in another life and pay off some more karmic debt which they have not been able to payoff in this life?
A. Our span of life depends upon our karma, and if one dies at birth or at a very young age, it is because that was the fate allotted to that particular life. That does not mean that after having this human form, that soul goes back to the Lord. Even though that soul has had no opportunity to make new karma in this life, there is still the Sinchit or store or reserve load of karmas from which the fate of the next life is determined.
Our karma can take us down to a lower species and our karma can also bring us back to the human form. It depends upon our attachments, our desires and cravings which we have not been able to fulfill or sublimate during the life-span, the "seeds" which we have sown and have to come back to reap the fruit thereof. All this determines where we have to go, and it does not mean that if we die young, we must go back to the Lord. No, that is a wrong conception. It hardly makes any difference whether we die young or old. Our karma, our desires and our attachments determine where we have to go as well as the span of that life and whether to a lower species or whether to come back to the human form.
I understood the references in your last post, (as most chleas will): crows / swans (symbols of the lower / higher soul-self), orange lakes (inner visions of the sea of souls: the Lake of Mansarover), the tunnel of Bunk Nal (explained in the science articles on the 2002 MP website, as the route the soul goes through as it travels various regions in the brain structures) and SGO referring to himself as "dogmeat" (but when does humility count as false?).
The nametags thing doesn't surprise me in the context of the way everything else is run on MP - with Military Precision - e.g. every seminar class starts on-time, to the second - maybe something to do with SGO once being an army-veteran, and Joy a school-teacher perhaps? Anyway, to me, the tag-counting etc seem like hallmarks of any organized organization, with a duty to be fair to its entire congregation, and I'm sure you and all the other chelas who perform/ed loving seva were inspired and assisted by having such structures in place, to stop total chaos ensuing. e.g. "why should i have to pay to enter, if that chela over there just got in for free?" etc...
Re. my provisional faith, yes until my 3rdi is opened and stays open, i can only rely on the evidence of my 5 senses, my thoughts, and my feelings, including of what is being presented on-thread here, and if anything came to those senses that truly shook my faith in what I was following, I would quit - but so far that hasn't happened.
The way i see it right in this NOW moment: SGO is sort of like the pope of a spiritual/religious organization, and, as with the Papacy, being leader of MP comes with certain responsibilities, as well as..well, maybe some olive trees...? (Okay, so I'm still processing that one...! But seriously (and this is just my speculation) if SGO is planning to build an institution that out-lives him, as I believe he once said, "he would be happy if MP had a run of 200 years", maybe the reported cash reserves are a legitmate "buffer" to ensure financial stability of an organization over this kind of time period?
What do the MPX-ers with more experience of MP finances opine of that?
Anyway, I respect that you @SP and others, have had much more first hand experience of SGO in your 16 years perhaps than I have in my 14, and thank you in return for respecting yes, we current chelas may still be "going through the system" until we reach our own conclusions. I'm going for broke, but with a Healthy Level of Skepticism till EYE OPENS and EYE KNOWS :-)
peace to all...more soon.
PS - It was Ford Johnson not Johnson Ford (my mix-up) on the link:
Probably important for me to clarify once again, what was once grey before is now clearly black and white, re:Gary Olsen being a sat guru, guruism in general and for that matter the masterpath and their ilk. You perhaps are in the grey about this, which BTW is not clarity, it is a lack of clarity, similar in many ways as being in the dark about something. No offense but some also call this ignorance.
As for my locking up the blog, well it was simply my use of the vernacular of "bovine excrement", apparently someone's got sensitivities for such words in the vernacular, despite what I had read about this being a PG-13 site. No matter, it is not of importance to me, and will use the necessary words that get the point across.
As for whether or not Allan is Still_Chealaing, well if it smells like a fish, acts like a fish, looks like a fish, well it might very well be a fish, or "the fish" in this example. Either way the similar attitudes by both of these poster's are expressed in similar fashion, let alone the same sort of incorrect grammar usage and writing style. What did strike me funny at 1st is how this person used the moniker of "Still_Chealaing", like it was some sort of intelligent use of my own moniker. Whatever, it certainly lacks creativity IMO.
As for your "positive consciousness expanding experiences", truly good for you. But that is you, your consciousness, not some sat guru, only your own belief and faith that make that so. (please read 'The Unknowing Sage" in depth to get the understanding needed, not just skim it).
Let me be very clear here, if someone believes in some guru great for them, if on the other hand if someone doesn't believe in a guru then that doesn't mean they are misguided, at a lower level of consciousness, or whatever derogatory slur that I have heard Gary use in tone and actuality about those who don't get on the MP or leave it, or who are following a different direction in life.
I am reminded of a quote by H. Jackson Brown; "People take different roads seeking fulfillment and happiness. Just because they're not on your road doesn't mean they've gotten lost."
However I know that Gary's comments at more than one meeting was typically saying of how tolerant he was for other belief systems, and other paths's in life, but right after saying that he would then talk trash about the belief systems not being of the highest, or that they are misguided, or lost. This is double speak, so it is no wonder then that chelas are seeing grey, since the use of such misdirection only confuses people's minds. At the very least this is arrogance, elitism, and, or disingenuous, and actually creates confusion.
Most aren't paying attention to his use of language, it in fact is this surreptitious use of language that undermines everything else, with the exception of his own chosen direction, and anyone who doesn't believe as he does is simply well,...lost, or in "Tinseltown" to use his words.
You mention in one of your most recent posts what other x-chelas think about the MP finance issue, as you positioned it. I see it differently than you, you seem to be making allowances for things that Gary says that they are not about, i.e. taking chela's money. Look if these teaching's were all that great then there would be no need to hoard this kind of money, they would simply be able to stand on their own. But as I see it, it simply means to perpetuate it, his legacy, his creation. -- Funny (in a hypocritical way) I know that is something that is completely counter to what he has stated about something that chela's shouldn't be caring about, yet that's the thing, he is trying to create a legacy, an idol to his own creativity, sounds like an ego trip to me. As I like to call it spiritual egotism, and yes it does exist, Faqir Chand mentions it.
In your final post you mention this Rebazar Tarzus chap, and it is interesting, since it has been pointed out that Darwin Gross, created this entity, and this Rebazar chap never lived, it is a complete work of fiction, that so many have been duped by. Do your homework on this one. This being so points to the fact that much of these so called paths, Eck also calls itself the path of masters, and the reasoning why Gary calls the masterpath as he has stated the "summum bonum". All of these are simply fictitious creations in order to make money off an unsuspecting public -- Now that is predatory. Don't know about you but that is not the action of a saint in anybody's book, if it is in your book of what is of the highest ethics, well that is your prerogative.
Look you still have this provisional faith thing, which is what is asked of chelas up until their 2nd initiation, but when you make that commitment, after then I believe as it is stated in the mp works that by the 3rd initiation (4 years or so on the mp) that should be over with that and full commitment to the mp and your chosen master is expected, nay demanded. Correct me if I am wrong on this?
So if after 14 years and likely higher than a 3rd initiate, and you haven't gotten past this provisional faith thing, well doesn't that tell you something about this mp thing?
I mean if you get all of this great positive expanding consciousness experiences, etc.. why wouldn't you have fully committed to it?
Is there something still that has not been answered or addressed, especially given the time, energy and attention that you've devoted to it so far that at least by now you'd have greater clarity about all of this stuff?
What I am saying more directly is that you've given yourself enough time to all of this, that these misgivings, issues, challenges, etc...should be cleared up by now, shouldn't they? Or is 14 years not enough time? I would think it is
Honestly it seems to me at least that you suffered from what I did, what I call the "spin cycle" going back over the same stuff, seeing inconsistencies / contradictions, and not being able to extricate yourself from it, since to do so would cause a loss of faith & beleif and all of the other supposed goodies that the mp offers.
And I am here to tell you, and this is speaking from experience, that you won't see an end to this "spin cycle" until you walk away from it, and apply that discerning engineering mind of yours to tackle these inconsistencies / issues.
Denial in this case my dear friend is not your buddy, and yet that is exactly what Gary is asking you to do, to deny your own ability to understand and get questions answered. By his demanding that no questioning be allowed of these aspects that have been presented.
God gave you a mind to use, don't let someone else's belief system steal that from you. It is a theft, IMNSHO.
Search your thought and feeling's on this, what makes sense to you? What hypothesis has the least amount of variables to account for the inconsistencies?
Hey if to works for you, sincerely ask God to deliver you to the truth of this, to provide the necessary clarity.
I have asked myself this one from the very beginning. Hey why would there be so much difference of opinion as expressed here on this blog, as Peacemaker21 had presented?
If it was oh so clear then there would be no issue right?
Spiritual mastery seems to have so many different meanings depending on who you talk to, or read about it, that it came down to a faith / belief system, to philosophy, that it became quite an endeavor in and of itself to believe in one particular perspective of what that definition actually was.
Anyway I did a little internet search about mastery and came across the following link specifically about another form of mastery from the Urban Monk.
Now I got quite a bit from reading through that link, in fact more than I had in all of the years I was on the mp. So from that I have come to believe from my own experiences that everything that was presented by mp is about achieving emotional mastery, but in fact for me at least, was about denying my own feelings and thoughts.
What do others have to say about this?
I bring this up specifically since it is at the root of what I believe that the mp purports to provide to those who choose to follow it. If it provided that in actuality to people great, but if it didn't, well what does it provide? And for whom?
Perhaps this thread will come up for discussion at the San Diego event in a couple weeks.
I wish I could be a fly on the wall at one of these things.
Nice thought.
But that would require courage, honesty, (emotional or otherwise), sincerity, and a willingness to open themselves up to potential criticism that I believe is unlikely to happen. Integrity is not a calling card of the mp or Gary that I have seen, despite what Gary says. Just because he says it don't necessarily make it so.
That is if past behavior is any indication of future behavior, simply put, they'd have to open themselves up to their own "bovine excrement" being exposed, at the very least.
Who knows there may still be hope? -- I say this because I've been posting here for a little over 5 weeks now, and there have been more than 12,000 views of just my own postings. And I am not taking away from anyone else's postings or contribution when I state that.
Clearly there are others who are interested in reading this blog beyond the few that are posting here, perhaps there are some chelas who are reading this and who can think for themselves and have issues that they would like to see addressed.
Courage, honor, integrity, truth, are they a part of the consciousness of the chela's on the mp, perhaps one of them at least?
Hmmm......
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links, karma and overcoming the fear of D'eath
chela to chela, in the schoolyard of life
But seriously (and this is just my speculation) if SGO is planning to build an institution that out-lives him, as I believe he once said, "he would be happy if MP had a run of 200 years", maybe the reported cash reserves are a legitmate "buffer" to ensure financial stability of an organization over this kind of time period?
re: PM21's comments
