Gary Olsen's "Master Path" - anybody familiar? (Savior, comparison, America)

[allan1015]

Originally Posted by Violet11

You twist my words again which is no surprise.

It would be nice if you could stop the combative, hostile snipes, I've been trying, won't you make the same effort?

We are both making some errors here. I feel your kinda missing my point as well, the word recommend or forbids wasnt the thrust of my point, though I apologize for using the wrong word.

Appreciate it if you would allow me the time to explain this again.

The lesson was a recommendation not to give one's power away to detractors, to the past, to the future, to the kids, or to Gary himself. We agree?

The lesson was'nt a recommendation not talking to Detractors, or not to Listen to Gary. It was a recommendation/lesson to not give my power to the past, it wasn't a recommendation to not have a past. We agree?

why go against any of his recommendations if you yourself concluded that he prefers you not to engage detractors for your own good.

Again that is NOT the what he said. You would have to say he prefers I don't listen to him either if you follow your view to it conclusion.

Lets say your a detractor. Its simply recommending I not give you my 'power' I can interact with you all day long.

I guess if you assume that I am not able to interact with you at all without loosing myself, yielding my power to you, then if you could conclude as you have. But Sri Gary doesn't seem to assume I am weak like that, just recommending I stay aware of it, he was as I see it raising the awareness of how we can give our power away to others, to things,

I hope thats clearer now. If not I am at your service and would love to discuss it further if we are still not on the same page with what was being taught.

[deepcynic]

allan, if you are not aware of your propensity to twist peoples words here, you are simply not aware.

[allan1015]

Originally Posted by Violet11

And how is it that you remember the unveiling and/or this woman who was "in her 70's" as a "sweet woman", or are you going on hearsay? Because I saw that drawing many years ago, long before you'd even heard of MP.

I did say it was at satsang? a great number of them are available on audio tape, cd and video. Sorry if I left that out thought I had. I can understand your suspicion. I really appreciate the chance to clear that up. thanks

I also had a conversation with another chela at my first satsang. Standing in the book room looking at the picture with a friend who I knew for a few years online before, actually one of the guys I spent time trying to convince MP was no good. I'm pretty sure, though cant swear he was at the aforemetnioned satsang.

[allan1015]

Originally Posted by deepcynic

allan, if you are not aware of your propensity to twist peoples words here, you are simply not aware.

I believe we are all guilty of that. But thanks for pointing it out.

I am aware of your impression that its twisting, though unclear what you think the cause is for it, if intentional or not?

I do think that when one restricts themselves to sound byte style retorts, quips and stuff its easier to avoid. But when one is trying to have a conversation, especially on complex subjects, its easier to get things wrong.

Which is why a good amount of patience and respect can go a long way to a useful dialog in these kind of both complicated, nuanced and close to one hearts conversations.

You agree?

[Violet11]

I believe you missed the point, the artist did the drawing, it was her way of showing what was in her heart, or she said it something like that. So I'm at a loss as to why the continued phrasing that 'Gary placed himself' ?

You missed MY point. Regardless of how/why it was created, Gary and/or MasterPath distributed the drawing and included it in MasterPath materials. Gary approved of himself being portayed on equal with well-known spiritual figures like Jesus. By virtue of the fact that he allowed it to be distributed, it's logical to conclude he views himself that way. As far as deities go, Christians do worship Jesus as part of the triune God. But whether or not I consider Jesus a deity is not the point. It's just ludicrous for Gary to be portrayed in the same light anyway you look at it. It gives the illusion of a level of credibility that is unfounded and undeserved.

It's also ludicrous that I'm even answering you again. And ludicrous that you've claimed not to defend Gary or MP. We've heard so much that's troubling about MP, and you're hell bent on proving others are wrong. What's funny is that with each post, you prove others right. You're letting us bait you. So here's another worm...do you know why Gary's own stepkids and other family do not follow his master path?

[deepcynic]

Originally Posted by allan1015

You agree?

NO, I do NOT agree! You are here to defend MasterPath and Gary Olsen.

You have made no bones about it, yet you profess not to defend them. You are not credible in any way.

I have said before that I do not care what you do, I accept that you find some solace in this cash-cow psuedoreligion, but to aver that you are not defending MP is disingenuous at best, and an outright lie at worst.

I am here to make folks aware of the scam, you are here to defend it.

You and I will never agree!

[Violet11]

It would be nice if you could stop the combative, hostile snipes, I've been trying, won't you make the same effort?

Haha, sorry I thought you told me I didn't have to change...

However, I do sense some amount of respectful and honest communication with you, sometimes, and even rememberingyou at times. So for you two it might matter and I will make an effort. No obligation on your part to change at all.

But anyway, I don't think that quote was a particularly hostile one. Maybe you're projecting.

[Violet11]

I did say it was at satsang? a great number of them are available on audio tape, cd and video. Sorry if I left that out thought I had. I can understand your suspicion. I really appreciate the chance to clear that up. thanks

It was your characterization of the artist that made it seem like you were claiming to know her personally. Sort of like you were insinuating once here that another MP chela was your dear friend and it turned out you'd never met him. Okay, I know. So you meant online friend. Perhaps because some of us communicate more offline than on, our definition of "friend" differs. No big deal I guess, just another observation of how things get confused. But in any case, I'd be curious to know if you can approximate the year of this satsang unveiling?

[Violet11]

By the way,

I just think sit fair we acknowledge the your issue with L&S is it doesn't agree with your Christian values, I just think disclosure is fair play, agree?

I'm not a Christian.

[allan1015]

I did understand that point. I didnt miss it I just didn't respond to spend time on oit

I didn't focus much on the details of your'e concerns because they are not not wrong, from your perspective. Its not so much a matter of facts at issue. It is a matter of perspective and basic beliefs. Said another way - Your 'arguments' are based on your perspective of Jesus, of Gary and what the painting represents, etc. I am not all that interested in changing your perspective.

From my view Jesus was a Sat Guru of the L&S tradition. Not a deity but a soul, like us, sent by God to do a mission. Same as other Sat Gurus. A bigger mission perhaps, but much shorter in length as well. The picture is a chronological order of past Sat Gurus. Its a MP picture so Gary is there. Thats about it. The picture would be just as valid for me if another Sat Guru was in the front.

If you don't believe Gary is a Sat Guru, or if you believe Jesus was ultra special, a deity, and many other things, then your 'arguments' hold true.
It is a ludicrous picture! - when viewed from your perspective and context.

My point is that its not my 'logic' or conclusion thats ludicrous, you just don't agree with my initial 'assumptions' It's a difference in belief systems, you can call my belief system ludicrous if you like. But my 'logic' is fine.

I guess the only factual things that comes to mind is that while a perspective of time has made Jesus a big deal or some of the other in that picture are seen as big deal now, they weren't all seen as big deals in thier life time. Brother Jesus was simply a small time radical and cult leader in his life time.

--whether or not I consider Jesus a deity is not the point.

To the extent your say there is a deity in the picture it is very much the point. There is no deity in the picture

--and you're hell bent on proving others are wrong.

Sorry you feel that way.

Are you saying that you and others have no interest in proving me wrong? I am unclear on the difference between your efforts and mine then? Are we not both here so offer our truths, our perspectives on MP?

From my perspective, I am hell bent on presenting as full a view and facts as I can. I am here to have my views of MP presented. If it shows others to be wrong along the way, I think we all benefit, but it is not the intent.

Have you notice there aren't many, Id say none but I cant be that sure, corrections to my 'facts'? Is that correct? I dont mean differences in opinion or underlying belief systems.

I understand my persistence, tenacity can be frustrating. Not much I can do about that. Everyone has benefited from my presence and efforts here, have they not?

--do you know why Gary's own stepkids and other family do not follow his master path?

Why should they? Thinking they should is pretty much against the very basic tenets of all of Shabda Yoga. To me its validation of authenticity
I can explain if you like.

I'd never thought about this, but did Jesus's parents become Christians? His brother did, never thought about his parents, uncles, cousins, etc. How about Buddha's parents? Did they convert to 'Buddhism'. I don't know if you
believe there have been any authentic Sat Gurus, masters or Saints, if you do any idea what the trends are for family, step kids, relatives?


Please keep on baiting me, I am having a wonderful time. New thoughts and insights, perspectives. Learning, its been a real pleasure and I am happy I have been able to be of service to you and yours.

I am also indebted to you for pointing out how combative this place had shaped me. It was a beautiful insight, it was actual perfectly synchronistic with the discussion of giving away my power. To think you were a vehicle for masters recognition - just perfect.

Blessings be