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An omnipotent God can do anything. If you actually believe this then why bother with arguing about science at all? That is all the argument you should need.
I'm arguing the science because you say there is no evidence to back it up. There is evidence.
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By the way science has never claimed the builders of the pyramids and Aztec structures were impossible...That is a rather silly argument.
Really? Maybe you should do a little reading about the pyramids and the technology science says the egyptians had available to them at the time.
The same goes for the Aztec pyramids and walls.
Of course they could be built because they were but scienctifically speaking they shouldn't have been able to.
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A 450 foot wooden boat is NOT possible.
How do you come to that conclusion? Educate me. Show me were anybody has tried.
Really? Maybe you should do a little reading about the pyramids and the technology science says the egyptians had available to them at the time.
The same goes for the Aztec pyramids and walls.
Of course they could be built because they were but scienctifically speaking they shouldn't have been able to.
Here, here, we all know pyramids were built by aliens, or with their guidance.
Huh? My thoughtless tirade? I was only responding to a mindless answer to an attempt at a logical argument.
No no, my friend... I was just being my usual sarcastic self! I was suggesting that the other side would no doubt view your posts as hostile and thoughtless. After all, we have the confession of Cambell34, which I've noted below, as evidence. As in, no matter what, he believes the bible. Literally. Who's really thoughtless here? Certainly not you.
Take most everything I say as potentially sarcastic. It's just my style. Sorry if I hurt your feelings; you make good points, like the following...
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Originally Posted by leftydan6
See? Like I said, impossible to have a rational argument with someone who explains everything with "god did it". No, so if "god" made all the scientists, what about the rapists, child molestors, murderers, the thieves, the people who believe in the many other "gods" out there, the deformed, the severly disabled, and the psychotic? If "god" is so great, how come there are so many mistakes? If "god" is so powerful, how would the majority of the world believe in a different one?
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Originally Posted by Campbell34
I believe everything in the Bible is a fact, and as new historlcal discoveries are unearthed those Biblical facts are being confirmed.
Or, if you'd care to be objective for a change, dis-proved....
Can your present us with historical evidence that shows us the Bible is in error?
Campbell, are you serious here? First, you categorically state right above here that you blindly believe the bible. After all, you have no choice as a fundamentalist Xtian who can't quite bring yourself to see the bible as a basic spiritual aand ethical guidebook. Which it does admirably.
But, too bad for your absolutist opinion, logic just keeps getting in the way. If the original Genesis authors had known that the earth wasn't flat, or if they'd had even a basic understanding of how to calculate volumes, rainfall rates, evaporation constants, the effects of a massive new additional water mass on rotational dynamics of the earth, or the staggering number of species old Noah would have to have "convinced" to board and co-exist on even a super-sized Ark, the problems of feeding them, that nasty T-Rex issue, and on and on,... Well, they'd have probably toned down the story if they also knew people would be trying to accept it as literal truth. Of course that can't have been their intent, but it apparently is yours.
To stick to illogical conclusions in the face of our logical inquiries, plus the absence of any proof of the existance of an Ark despite some interesting basalt geo-formations we're not allowed to look at, well, that's just plain silly. You know it, but I understand you can't admit it. You prefer to feel good and comfortable and secure and faithful through a no-questions-asked approach.
But puh-leeezzz.. Don't insult our intelligence by asking us to disprove all of the bible's fanciful tales of miracle after miracle. Mostly that's been done from the logic perspective, but that's not acceptable to you, at least in public. I for one am open, quite open really, to viewing just one video of just one true miracle with no other possible explanation. Or alternately, I'll accept an official invite to attend the spontaneous regeneration of an amputated limb, for example, as a result of a few hundred ardent prayers for a good Christian military vet returning legless from Iraq. Or does your god just hate all amputees, those who've lost an eye, finger, arm, kidney, etc. etc. He apparently has NEVER listened to their prayers! (He must have a bigger plan for those so sadly afflicted, right? right?)
Then, brothers and sisters, you'll have lost me forever to the side of blind faith! Long live the Ark! Ah-men!
I'm arguing the science because you say there is no evidence to back it up. There is evidence.
Really? Maybe you should do a little reading about the pyramids and the technology science says the egyptians had available to them at the time.
The same goes for the Aztec pyramids and walls.
Of course they could be built because they were but scienctifically speaking they shouldn't have been able to.
How do you come to that conclusion? Educate me. Show me were anybody has tried.
I have posted this before.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...t_wooden_ships
Here is a list of the largest wooden ships. Notice that the largest, even though they were reinforced with steel or iron were not seaworthy. The largest mentioned, the Wyoming had an overall length of 450 feet, although the actual deck length was just 350 feet. At the very bottom of the list is the largest wooden boat ever built...The mythical Noah's ark.
So even if Noah had a steel foundry at his disposal, it would still be impossible.
Perhaps a bit of your own research might be the order of the day regarding pyramids....Google is your friend.
Campbell, are you serious here? First, you categorically state right above here that you blindly believe the bible. After all, you have no choice as a fundamentalist Xtian who can't quite bring yourself to see the bible as a basic spiritual aand ethical guidebook. Which it does admirably.
But, too bad for your absolutist opinion, logic just keeps getting in the way. If the original Genesis authors had known that the earth wasn't flat, or if they'd had even a basic understanding of how to calculate volumes, rainfall rates, evaporation constants, the effects of a massive new additional water mass on rotational dynamics of the earth, or the staggering number of species old Noah would have to have "convinced" to board and co-exist on even a super-sized Ark, the problems of feeding them, that nasty T-Rex issue, and on and on,... Well, they'd have probably toned down the story if they also knew people would be trying to accept it as literal truth. Of course that can't have been their intent, but it apparently is yours.
To stick to illogical conclusions in the face of our logical inquiries, plus the absence of any proof of the existance of an Ark despite some interesting basalt geo-formations we're not allowed to look at, well, that's just plain silly. You know it, but I understand you can't admit it. You prefer to feel good and comfortable and secure and faithful through a no-questions-asked approach.
But puh-leeezzz.. Don't insult our intelligence by asking us to disprove all of the bible's fanciful tales of miracle after miracle. Mostly that's been done from the logic perspective, but that's not acceptable to you, at least in public. I for one am open, quite open really, to viewing just one video of just one true miracle with no other possible explanation. Or alternately, I'll accept an official invite to attend the spontaneous regeneration of an amputated limb, for example, as a result of a few hundred ardent prayers for a good Christian military vet returning legless from Iraq. Or does your god just hate all amputees, those who've lost an eye, finger, arm, kidney, etc. etc. He apparently has NEVER listened to their prayers! (He must have a bigger plan for those so sadly afflicted, right? right?)
Then, brothers and sisters, you'll have lost me forever to the side of blind faith! Long live the Ark! Ah-men!
My conclusions are not illogical, your conclusions are based on human understanding which has been proven time after time to be flawed. My encounters with God has only proven to me that His capablilities have been greatly underestimated by an unbelieveing world. And because of this, and because of your limited humanistic understanding, you do not have a clue as to what God can do. The Bible is being proven by historical discovery to be a Book that can be trusted. The prophecies of the Bible has revealed to us that they can be believed as well. Your ability to look the other way on such discoveries and established facts, has only revealed to me your obvious and active bias. Historical discovery have only proven the Bible to be correct. You guys are pretty good at makeing general negative statements. Could you present to me evidence that would prove the Bibles historical accounts to be in error?
My conclusions are not illogical, your conclusions are based on human understanding which has been proven time after time to be flawed. My encounters with God has only proven to me that His capablilities have been greatly underestimated by an unbelieveing world. And because of this, and because of your limited humanistic understanding, you do not have a clue as to what God can do. The Bible is being proven by historical discovery to be a Book that can be trusted. The prophecies of the Bible has revealed to us that they can be believed as well. Your ability to look the other way on such discoveries and established facts, has only revealed to me your obvious and active bias. Historical discovery have only proven the Bible to be correct. You guys are pretty good at makeing general negative statements. Could you present to me evidence that would prove the Bibles historical accounts to be in error?
Can you please give me evidence that proves the historical accounts of Hercules are in error? Until you do, I am rational in thinking Hercules is the god I should worship.
I have posted this before.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world's_largest_wooden_ships
Here is a list of the largest wooden ships. Notice that the largest, even though they were reinforced with steel or iron were not seaworthy. The largest mentioned, the Wyoming had an overall length of 450 feet, although the actual deck length was just 350 feet. At the very bottom of the list is the largest wooden boat ever built...The mythical Noah's ark.
That's comparing apple to oranges.
Sailing ships are built entirely different than the ark would have been. The Ark only had to float. That's it. Sailing ships have to sail.
Nobody that I'm aware of has tried to build a 450 ft boat that just floats and isn't designed to go anywhere.
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Perhaps a bit of your own research might be the order of the day regarding pyramids....Google is your friend.
I'm not even going to get into it about the pyramids. The mysteries of how they were built is a given. If you've got it all figured out and know how to do it with the tools and technology of the time, let the world know. You'll be famous.
The Pretoria was the largest wooden barge I was able to find. It was 338 feet long by 44 feet wide and was built in 1900. To strengthen its wooden frame and hull, the Pretoria included steel keelson plates, steel chords , steel arches , and also it was diagonally strapped with steel. It needed a donkey engine to run a pump to keep its interior dry. The Pretoria sunk in a storm in 1905.
450 foot boat/barge or whatever will not be seaworthy, as the long planks will flex and leak...There were no donkey engines in Noah's time ...Only donkeys, and no pump had been invented, not to mention no steel.
Sure the ark had to float, but any swells or waves would have sunk it.
Can you please give me evidence that proves the historical accounts of Hercules are in error? Until you do, I am rational in thinking Hercules is the god I should worship.
Can you show me prophecies that prove that Hercules was predicted to come to earth to save man from their sins. Does Hercules offer evidence in written form that would show Him to be a God that knows the future? Jesus Christ does this, what can Hercules show us? I can show evidence for Christ truth, what can you show us for Hercules?
The Pretoria was the largest wooden barge I was able to find. It was 338 feet long by 44 feet wide and was built in 1900. To strengthen its wooden frame and hull, the Pretoria included steel keelson plates, steel chords , steel arches , and also it was diagonally strapped with steel. It needed a donkey engine to run a pump to keep its interior dry. The Pretoria sunk in a storm in 1905.
450 foot boat/barge or whatever will not be seaworthy, as the long planks will flex and leak...There were no donkey engines in Noah's time ...Only donkeys, and no pump had been invented, not to mention no steel.
Sure the ark had to float, but any swells or waves would have sunk it.
Try harder....I'm not impressed so far.
The Bible has some remarkable stories, and the Bible has never been shown to be in error. Historical discoveries only support the truth of the Bible. Can you give me one good reason why I should not believe in a Book that has always been proven truthful? I am impressed with the Bibles truth. Your lack of faith is not built on evidence, it is built on a desire not to believe in God.
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Let us pray, brothers & sisters!
It's just my style. Sorry if I hurt your feelings; you make good points, like the following...
for example, as a result of a few hundred ardent prayers for a good Christian military vet returning legless from Iraq. Or does your god just hate all amputees, those who've lost an eye, finger, arm, kidney, etc. etc. He apparently has NEVER listened to their prayers! (He must have a bigger plan for those so sadly afflicted, right? right?)
