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Old 03-10-2009, 09:44 PM
 
Location: Minnesota
1,761 posts, read 1,707,951 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaniMae1 View Post
Okay, let me see if I can put this right. People say God loves us like we love our own kids. Now, would any parent have a bunch of kids and say, "you do exactly as I say or I will punish you forever by burning you eternally..." And the fact that he put demons and such down here with the kids that he "loves" so much. Wouldn't that be like putting our own kids in a den of lions? Something doesn't add up here.

This is the exact question I had years ago and which stared me thinking that what the church had been teaching me all my early years may not have been true.

There is NO way anyone who is honest with you can defend why god would admit defeat and sent most of his human creation to eternal torment. That would be an unmitigated failure on gods part to not be able to provide a decent future for most of his creation.

I know many defend this idea by telling you that god offers salvation to those who accept it and if you don't.....it's your own damn fault. I don't buy that anymore. God will not leave anybody behind....period !

I don't feel any animosity for those who believe in the vengeful god idea. First of all it's what I was taught in my youth, so I do understand it very well and how convincing preachers and various christians can be. They are sold on the idea, no question about that. They truly do believe what they preach.

We all are on our own journey in this world. Some take one parth, some take another path....we'll all end up in the same place eventually.

I truly feel sorry for those who believe that most of humans will end up in hell as the bible and many churches say. It's a scary and fearful way to live your life....I've been there :-)
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Old 03-11-2009, 08:26 AM
 
63,505 posts, read 39,800,339 times
Reputation: 7809
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasper1372 View Post
This is the exact question I had years ago and which stared me thinking that what the church had been teaching me all my early years may not have been true.

There is NO way anyone who is honest with you can defend why god would admit defeat and sent most of his human creation to eternal torment. That would be an unmitigated failure on gods part to not be able to provide a decent future for most of his creation.

I know many defend this idea by telling you that god offers salvation to those who accept it and if you don't.....it's your own damn fault. I don't buy that anymore. God will not leave anybody behind....period !

I don't feel any animosity for those who believe in the vengeful god idea. First of all it's what I was taught in my youth, so I do understand it very well and how convincing preachers and various christians can be. They are sold on the idea, no question about that. They truly do believe what they preach.
This is the best test of whether or not it is a viable tenet . . . if it appeals to our negative human emotions or motives . . . it is NOT of God. That is evaluating the motives of God as the motives of flawed humans because ALL of our negative human emotions are the result of our flawed and sinful nature, period. God has no such flaws . . so notions of human justice do NOT apply to God. God's justice is of a different type entirely.
Quote:
We all are on our own journey in this world. Some take one parth, some take another path....we'll all end up in the same place eventually.
Probably . . . but the character of the journeys are apt to be quite different and significantly less pleasant for many.
Quote:
I truly feel sorry for those who believe that most of humans will end up in hell as the bible and many churches say. It's a scary and fearful way to live your life....I've been there :-)
IT is an unnecessary fear for most of today's humans . . . but it was an essential fear for the more animalistic of our ancestors from 2000 years before Christ to several hundred years after. We just failed to evolve our understanding of the "Spirit" of the teachings and relied on the literal .
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Old 03-11-2009, 09:22 AM
 
4,655 posts, read 5,050,674 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaniMae1 View Post
Okay, let me see if I can put this right. People say God loves us like we love our own kids. Now, would any parent have a bunch of kids and say, "you do exactly as I say or I will punish you forever by burning you eternally..." And the fact that he put demons and such down here with the kids that he "loves" so much. Wouldn't that be like putting our own kids in a den of lions? Something doesn't add up here.

Who are his kids? The ones that love and believe in Him? Or the ones that pretend he doesn't exist and blaspheme his name?
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:07 AM
 
Location: Blankity-blank!
11,446 posts, read 16,152,630 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I LOVE NORTH CAROLINA View Post
No God does not send people to hell, they will go there because they made the wrong choice, they have rejected the free gift of eternal life. God does not force Himself on anyone.
One great problem the christians have is lacking the ability to distinguish the difference between a choice and ultimatum. There is a huge difference!
Do you really believe that people would actually choose eternal torture?
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:13 AM
 
4,655 posts, read 5,050,674 times
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Originally Posted by Visvaldis View Post
One great problem the christians have is lacking the ability to distinguish the difference between a choice and ultimatum. There is a huge difference!
Do you really believe that people would actually choose eternal torture?

If you hate God, why would you choose eternal praise and worship of Him?
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:22 AM
 
63,505 posts, read 39,800,339 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
Who are his kids? The ones that love and believe in Him? Or the ones that pretend he doesn't exist and blaspheme his name?
We ALL are . . . but rebellion is a very human trait and is triggered by the totalitarian human interpretations of our relationship to God in our human-created religions . . . not God's doing at all. Imposing "adult tree" expectations on "sprouts, saplings, and young trees" causes most of the discord, failures and eventual rebellion in defiance of the intolerant negative human interpretations.
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:08 AM
 
4,655 posts, read 5,050,674 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
We ALL are . . . but rebellion is a very human trait and is triggered by the totalitarian human interpretations of our relationship to God in our human-created religions . . . not God's doing at all. Imposing "adult tree" expectations on "sprouts, saplings, and young trees" causes most of the discord, failures and eventual rebellion in defiance of the intolerant negative human interpretations.




Um..........no. At least not according to the Bible. We are NOT all God's children. It's a nice thought...but just not true.
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
520 posts, read 893,934 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post



Um..........no. At least not according to the Bible. We are NOT all God's children. It's a nice thought...but just not true.
Since god is not accepting of all people does this make him prejudgice then?

What criteria must one meet to be a "child of god"?
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:19 AM
 
4,655 posts, read 5,050,674 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forkpower View Post
Since god is not accepting of all people does this make him prejudgice then?

What criteria must one meet to be a "child of god"?

faith in him. no...it's not based on race or any other human attribute. There is neither Jew nor Gentile, male nor female in Christ.
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Blankity-blank!
11,446 posts, read 16,152,630 times
Reputation: 6958
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
If you hate God, why would you choose eternal praise and worship of Him?
Analyze your post, it doesn't make sense. What are you trying to say?
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