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Old 01-25-2009, 06:28 PM
 
Location: Nashville, Tn
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ILNC wrote:
Quote:
I know this story is hard for a nonbeliever to understand, but God tested Abraham not to trip him, and watch him fall, but to deepen his capacity to obey God and develop his character.
I think I understand your point of view but I can't even conceive of a loving God asking a parent to kill a child. If I had a child I would give my own life to protect him or her from a dangerous situation. In this circumstances, the dangerous situation is the parent themselves, and God is asking them to commit homicide which also violates one of the Ten Commandments. I truly don't comprehend how this can be something positive.
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Old 01-25-2009, 06:39 PM
 
Location: Minnesota
1,489 posts, read 1,281,067 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MontanaGuy View Post
ILNC wrote:

I think I understand your point of view but I can't even conceive of a loving God asking a parent to kill a child. If I had a child I would give my own life to protect him or her from a dangerous situation. In this circumstances, the dangerous situation is the parent themselves, and God is asking them to commit homicide which also violates one of the Ten Commandments. I truly don't comprehend how this can be something positive.

MontanaGuy you are absolutely correct. I cannot even comprehend a god that would test you by asking you to kill someone in your family and then at the last minute before you plunged the knife in say "oh, just kidding".

Again, as I've said before, if you saw your neighbor doing this you'd sure try to stop him....even if he did tell you god told him to do it.

This biblical story is truly over the top and in my own opinion anyone who defends it could really be a dangerous person in certain situations if they truly believe that god would sanction attempted murder of family members.
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Old 01-25-2009, 08:22 PM
 
Location: God's Country
21,437 posts, read 29,615,436 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MontanaGuy View Post
ILNC wrote:

I think I understand your point of view but I can't even conceive of a loving God asking a parent to kill a child. If I had a child I would give my own life to protect him or her from a dangerous situation. In this circumstances, the dangerous situation is the parent themselves, and God is asking them to commit homicide which also violates one of the Ten Commandments. I truly don't comprehend how this can be something positive.
It was never God's intention for Isaac to die, He wanted Abraham to sacrifice Isaac in his heart so it would clear that Abraham loved God more than he loved his long awaited son. Through this difficult experience Abraham strengthened his commitment to obey God, he also learned about God's ability to provide. I have much faith in verse 8 "God will provide", He always has provided for me, just as He promised.
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Old 01-25-2009, 08:46 PM
 
Location: Maryland
3,540 posts, read 5,972,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasper1372 View Post
[

Why would you assume from what I said that I don't belive in god ? It seems bass ackwards to me that because I would question a parent killing a child on an alter in the backyard I don't belive in god....wow, please explain your thinking here.

If you can't answer the qustion, thats fine, but I just don't see how me questioning something in the bible means I can't believe in god. I just don't happen to believe this story is literal. My whole point is that man wrote the bible, inspired at times, probably not at other times due to misunderstanding things a bit.

I fail to see how questioning things means I can't believe in god. I do admit however that the story is so evil it's unbelievable to me.
I'm sorry for jumping to conclusions.
I will assume then, that you do believe in God.
If we share a belief in the same God, then maybe my explaination will make sense:

If God were to speak directly to me, I would do whatever God told me to do.
I start with the absolute belief ( no faith now, I speaking to God ) that God = perfect Love. And if I don't understand the command, it's because I'm unable to. But the ultimate result will be of God ( perfect Love ).
In other words, the final consequence of my action(s) would be for the good.

Now you may ask;
Do you unquestionably obey every command written in the Bible?

No I don't.
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Old 01-25-2009, 08:46 PM
 
Location: Gaston, North Carolina
4,213 posts, read 4,912,722 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jroyals View Post
If you were Abraham, and God asked you to murder your beloved son, what would you have told him?

Just curious.
I would have agreed to do so because deep down inside I know He would not have allowed such a thing and if I was wrong I would also know my child would be better of with God than being in this world. What must be remembered is that God specifically told Abraham that Issac would be the father of many nations just as Abraham would be and if Issac was to be sacrificed then God would have been a liar and Abraham knew God was not a liar.
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Old 01-26-2009, 06:54 AM
 
787 posts, read 1,516,163 times
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I can kind of understand Christians whom read the new testament and use that, but those that refer to the old testament are just plain delusional. You could spend years trying to work out the logic behind any of the heaps of the stories of the old testament and not get anywhere.
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Old 01-26-2009, 07:19 AM
 
Location: LAT: 40.77 LON: 73.98
604 posts, read 963,736 times
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Forgive me for not believing ANY of this and relegating it, as with many other biblical details, to mere nonsense. The character of Abram/Abraham is suspect to me. He seems to have always heard voices speaking to him. First, he hears a voice that tells him to get up and leave his ancestral homeland. Next he hears voices (a few times) telling him he is going to be something great and that essentially, human history would revolve around him and his descendants and finally, a voice that tells him to kill his some and then not to kill his son. On another occasion, he even takes his wife's advice to knock up their maid and then kicks the same maid out because his wife started *itchin. He seemed to love listening to voices as much a later hero, Moses.

Then there is another view to this. Someone decided to write a "once upon a time" story starring Abraham and we all know you don't need to write facts when you go that route.
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Old 01-26-2009, 09:07 AM
 
Location: Montrose, CA
3,031 posts, read 7,887,064 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasper1372 View Post
So, I'm just curious. If god told you to sacrifice your son/daughter via a knife into the chest cavity....would you do it ?

If you noticed your neighbor strapping his son/daughter to an alter in the backyard and raising a knife to kill him/her...what would you do ? Would you accept his explanation that god told him to do it or would you call the authorities and rant about the demon possessed crazed man next door that attempted to kill his kid ?

Just questions I've always wanted to ask of someone who thinks this story in the bible is true and believes god would do this type of thing.
People kill their kids all the time and say that god told them to do it.
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Old 01-26-2009, 09:08 AM
 
Location: Montrose, CA
3,031 posts, read 7,887,064 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasper1372 View Post
MontanaGuy you are absolutely correct. I cannot even comprehend a god that would test you by asking you to kill someone in your family and then at the last minute before you plunged the knife in say "oh, just kidding".
Thing is, god would have no NEED to "test" anyone, including Abraham, because god is supposedly omniscient and therefore wouldn't need proof of a human's devotion. He'd know that Abraham would do it when asked, and therefore wouldn't need to ask.

Check and mate, xtians.
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Old 01-26-2009, 09:49 AM
 
Location: God's Country
21,437 posts, read 29,615,436 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuSuSushi View Post
Thing is, god would have no NEED to "test" anyone, including Abraham, because god is supposedly omniscient and therefore wouldn't need proof of a human's devotion. He'd know that Abraham would do it when asked, and therefore wouldn't need to ask.

Check and mate, xtians.
God wasn't testing Abraham so He would know, He was testing Abraham to Abraham would know, it was for Abraham, not God. And again, I understand how this is confusing to non Christians.
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