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Old 02-20-2009, 06:29 AM
 
1,577 posts, read 3,284,111 times
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See thats what gets me. You can be a good, moral and ethical person, even contribute for your fellow man, without being the least bit religious. Doing it because its just the right thing to do and because it makes you feel good to do it, doesn't have to be a mythological thing.

In fact, i feel having a spiritual (or feel good inside) feeling doesn't necessarily imply religion or anything supernatural.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiloh1 View Post
If there was no God of course I would not go to church why would I waste my time. I may still be 'moral' (obviously without any justification and deluded if I think there is) unlike so many atheists try to do. Atheists should have the power of their conviction and beliefs to move toward complete relativism and a selfish existence. Try to implement Nietzsche's or Sarte's philosophy if you want to not be a hypocritical atheist. If I live my life as if ther is a God and then there is not then I lived a life according to my beliefs and conscience and loose nothing if on the otherhand ther is a God as an atheist not only do you live contray to your beliefs in the end you lose everthing.
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Old 02-20-2009, 10:42 AM
 
1,366 posts, read 1,946,138 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiloh1 View Post
If there was no God of course I would not go to church why would I waste my time. I may still be 'moral' (obviously without any justification and deluded if I think there is) unlike so many atheists try to do. Atheists should have the power of their conviction and beliefs to move toward complete relativism and a selfish existence. Try to implement Nietzsche's or Sarte's philosophy if you want to not be a hypocritical atheist. If I live my life as if ther is a God and then there is not then I lived a life according to my beliefs and conscience and loose nothing if on the otherhand ther is a God as an atheist not only do you live contray to your beliefs in the end you lose everthing.

The problem with your argument is that we live in a society with consequences regardless of being religious or atheist. Most of us are taught from a young age to follow certain rules that society has set. In this sense, we are no different than a dog. Are dogs religious? If a dog is taught to fight and kill from a young age it's much more likely to have this behavior its entire life. If a puppy is raised to be obedient from a young age then it is much more likely to have a more obedient behavior its entire life.
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Old 02-26-2009, 10:18 PM
 
Location: Rome, Georgia
2,662 posts, read 3,230,785 times
Reputation: 1838
I would not continue to go to church. Of course, I don't go to church anyway(church people are stuffy). I would, however, load up my rifle and shoot up a strip mall. Just seems way easier to do if there are no eternal ramifications. I would then lobby to end the lives of all people over the age of 50, and anyone with any kind of deformity. Overpopulation is a serious threat to the continued existence of Humankind, and we just can't afford to have those mouths to feed. Families should be limited to one child per, and then only with license. Any humanitarian aid to 3rd world contries should immediately stop. Compassion is for wimps who don't know any better. Then I would just start looking out for #1, and drink alot of beer(oh wait, I already do that...mmmm tasty)
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Old 02-26-2009, 10:54 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,144 posts, read 30,924,548 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgiafrog View Post
I would not continue to go to church. Of course, I don't go to church anyway(church people are stuffy). I would, however, load up my rifle and shoot up a strip mall. Just seems way easier to do if there are no eternal ramifications. I would then lobby to end the lives of all people over the age of 50, and anyone with any kind of deformity. Overpopulation is a serious threat to the continued existence of Humankind, and we just can't afford to have those mouths to feed. Families should be limited to one child per, and then only with license. Any humanitarian aid to 3rd world contries should immediately stop. Compassion is for wimps who don't know any better. Then I would just start looking out for #1, and drink alot of beer(oh wait, I already do that...mmmm tasty)
You are a sick, sick individual if the only thing holding you back is what ever morality you extract from your religion...For the sake of humanity please stay a believer.
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Old 02-27-2009, 12:18 AM
 
2,255 posts, read 4,818,852 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
You are a sick, sick individual if the only thing holding you back is what ever morality you extract from your religion...For the sake of humanity please stay a believer.
You know, on the surface it does sound sick, but I believe it was a sort of illustrative sarcasm called satire.

Here >>>> "SATIRE" = use of irony, sarcasm, ridicule, or the like, in exposing, denoucing, or deriding vice, folly, etc.

You certainly are aware of it's use, since you and your buddies employ it here with the utmost professionalism on numerous occasions to put down the Kool-Aid Kids and their perceived off the wall delusional beliefs.

Now were you really outraged by his comments or did you simply employ the use of your own clever sarcasm here to illustrate that you simply curse the ground this dude walks on.

Ya see , I actually got what he meant and that he was not serious.
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Old 02-27-2009, 01:01 AM
 
2,255 posts, read 4,818,852 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgiafrog View Post
I would not continue to go to church. Of course, I don't go to church anyway(church people are stuffy). I would, however, load up my rifle and shoot up a strip mall. Just seems way easier to do if there are no eternal ramifications. I would then lobby to end the lives of all people over the age of 50, and anyone with any kind of deformity. Overpopulation is a serious threat to the continued existence of Humankind, and we just can't afford to have those mouths to feed. Families should be limited to one child per, and then only with license. Any humanitarian aid to 3rd world contries should immediately stop. Compassion is for wimps who don't know any better. Then I would just start looking out for #1, and drink alot of beer (oh wait, I already do that...mmmm tasty)
Actually in an illustrative way I do understand what you meant here. If indeed evolution is true, and indeed there is no God, then the planet is in major trouble. I believe that some areas of our Earth's environment are beyond the point of no return. Unfortunately you will not get any of the atheistic secularists here to open up and tell us what ideas, plans, schemes, etc their side has for reversing the damage done. Sadly, it's actually an element of their side who has been alerting mankind to the potential for global catastrophy and not the religious side. The religious side in effect, simply say it does'nt really matter because God's gonna blow it all up anyway.

But neither side has the answers for any of this. Now taking on where you left off and because the Athesit/Agnostic side here is mum on the subject for no other reasons than they really don't know, if they are correct, then many of the "Survival of the Fittest" - Natural Selection" evolutionary doctrines which brought us the pseudo-science policies of Eugenics of the late 19th & most of the 20th centuries, should be perfected and employed now. China's forced abortion policies would certainly make sense. It would simply be a matter of the creation of a Kinder/Gentler Rule of Law incorporated into such a policy for the ethical determination of who would warrant hitting the LOTTO on this one because they are determined by a board of geniuses set up by all governments/scientists to genetically, socially, industriously, etc decide who of us was inferior.

In the absolute holocaust sense, (and I hate to say this because I had familiy die there) if there is indeed no God, then the radical elimination policies thru extermination, euthanasia, etc of those who are judged and found unfit as a world citizen of our planet should carefully be looked at as a viable alternative to doing nothing, which results in everyone and everything dying here on Earth. I know it sounds outrageous, but it would technically follow the evolutionary pattern of the Fittest of the planet "humankind" taking their own evolutionary future into their own hands and cleaning up this mutated mess they created and putting back on track into the mutated pattern of perfection it once was. I guess what it would all prove is that evolution is really a failure because in pursuance it's own absolute perfected system, it actually blundered and created thru mutation "Humankind" which seemingly wants to destroy it all.

Well, at least you could'nt blame it on God.
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Old 02-27-2009, 02:14 AM
 
2,633 posts, read 4,469,300 times
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If that was a joke then it was very distasteful and very disturbing if it wasn't. Many religious people have convinced themselves that it should make sense to harm or kill innocent people. As an atheist I can honestly say it doesn't and that you are deluded if you try to use the lack of a god as an excuse to carry out your own perverted urges.
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Old 02-27-2009, 02:57 AM
 
2,255 posts, read 4,818,852 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coosjoaquin View Post
If that was a joke then it was very distasteful and very disturbing if it wasn't. Many religious people have convinced themselves that it should make sense to harm or kill innocent people. As an atheist I can honestly say it doesn't and that you are deluded if you try to use the lack of a god as an excuse to carry out your own perverted urges.
You may not like it, and yes it was a sarcastic satire for illustrative purposes only if you re-read it, but those apparently are the extreme measures necessary for saving this planet. I mean there continues to be not one of you that will come forward and explain to everyone how your perceived world view is going to benefit mankind.

Here's the problem. Those extremist pseudo-scientific policies of Selective Darwinism by the German Nazis/Japan Imperialist and the secular allied governments who seized their research and refused to prosecute these wicked scientist who developed the perverted policies were all based on their own personal warped and justified interpretation of the theory of evolution. The allies took these research findings to develope their own Eugenics Sterilization research for a better evolutionary human society. That had nothing to do with religion. It was strictly a secularist invention and religion's fault and bloodguilt was going to bed with them in full support of such policies. Religion should have known better, but they refused.

You've always seemed smart enough to me to be capable of doing the history research. Do it!!! I get the the point of your big bad beef with religion, but call it both ways here on the court REF.
Both of your sides are equally at fault for turning our planet and the human society that dwell on it into a varietable cesspool that it is. Why not be the first brave atheist on this forum and open a thread to give us ideas on how you see your secular society changing for the better over religious ideals. Unfortunately I don't think you or any of the rest of your crowd know anything on this matter than the religious gang.

The reason is you don't is that you guys don't like leaving yourself vulnerable and open to criticism. You'd rather be on the offense end of things rather than the defensive end and backed into a corner. All I did here is drain that pool and expose who are swimming naked and what they really are like without their clothes on.
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Old 02-27-2009, 03:49 AM
 
2,633 posts, read 4,469,300 times
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Bluepacific, just give me a straight answer:

Do you think a lack of a god justifies the killing of the innocent? If so why?
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Old 02-27-2009, 04:16 AM
 
2,255 posts, read 4,818,852 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coosjoaquin View Post
Bluepacific, just give me a straight answer:

Do you think a lack of a god justifies the killing of the innocent? If so why?
I personally don't think there would ever be a good reason for killing anyone. But in a pure unadulterated animalist evolutionary world we are demanded to believe in, any animalistic behavior from the definitions we are given would seem to be acceptable.

If you don't like the definitions and explanations , then post a thread for once explaining your position. None of you will do this. You like math. Read the book, "Just Numbers On A Screen" by Owen Platt. I believe Owen is one of your countrymen, although presently living in France.

The book is about how any ponzi scheme works, especially with the advent of computers on the world scene and the clever software programmers out there who've got the ability to develope a mathmatical software to make the investor believe he is daily receiving the promised , though mathematically improbable High Yeild returns on investments. This is exactly the realty of the way our present global world society works. It's phony , both religious and secular.

Again, if you don't like the erroneous conclusions your side receives , then step up to the plate.
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