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And you know this because you've already died and come back to life, therefore you are the self proclaimed expert on soul and evolution?? Just curious where your "expertise" came from.
Just curious, but have you died and come back to life? Do you have any expertise on souls? I would be happy to believe in souls if there were any evidence that they existed.
Just curious, but have you died and come back to life? Do you have any expertise on souls? I would be happy to believe in souls if there were any evidence that they existed.
No, unfortunately I have no expertise either. I believe that a "soul" is the human spirit at the core of our being. I believe it is who we are beneath the skin and the bones. However, whether the "soul" continues on after death, I can't answer.
I have read several so called "life after death" experiences, some of which were actually able to repeat things said after they were dead, by people in the room. One actually was able to tell the doctor where he laid an instrument that he had been unable to locate!
Some pretty bizarre stories, most of which start with "I was floating above my body, looking down I could see myself and everyone else in the room and could hear everything".
We do know that we are made up entirely of energy, so what happens with all that energy when we "die"? Does it just dissipate? I can't believe that is the case. Is that energy what people call "ghosts", that are felt as gusts of wind, etc.? Who knows...
I'd love to hear some opinions from all sides, Christians, atheists, scientists etc...
No, unfortunately I have no expertise either. I believe that a "soul" is the human spirit at the core of our being. I believe it is who we are beneath the skin and the bones. However, whether the "soul" continues on after death, I can't answer.
I have read several so called "life after death" experiences, some of which were actually able to repeat things said after they were dead, by people in the room. One actually was able to tell the doctor where he laid an instrument that he had been unable to locate!
Some pretty bizarre stories, most of which start with "I was floating above my body, looking down I could see myself and everyone else in the room and could hear everything".
We do know that we are made up entirely of energy, so what happens with all that energy when we "die"? Does it just dissipate? I can't believe that is the case. Is that energy what people call "ghosts", that are felt as gusts of wind, etc.? Who knows...
I'd love to hear some opinions from all sides, Christians, atheists, scientists etc...
Being an atheist, I do not believe in souls. The NDE's you speak of are all anecdotal with no real evidence to support them.
Any energy produced by our bodies ceases to exist as soon as we are no longer living.
I am open to any evidence showing otherwise.
You might want to start another thread, as this is off topic. Also, use the search feature to find all of the other threads on souls.
Madame Visionaire will see you now... (that'll be $25...)
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Originally Posted by Ever_Learning28
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We do know that we are made up entirely of energy, so what happens with all that energy when we "die"? Does it just dissipate? I can't believe that is the case. Is that energy what people call "ghosts", that are felt as gusts of wind, etc.? Who knows...
I'd love to hear some opinions from all sides, Christians, atheists, scientists etc...
We are not so much "made up of energy", Ever_L; we're made up of sub-atomic particles behaving fairly uniformly in accordance with, mostly, Newtonian physics, except when we stray into the larger set of quantum physics.
But, also, we being complex structures which initially absorbed energy to create our structures, just radiate it back into the environment on our death (hence we cool; you can feel that loss of energy anytime you touch someone), but also the chemical bonds within our complex bodily molecular structures do break down or are assisted in this by bacteria, molds, other animals (worms, etc) who complete the process until we are but dust and volatile hydrocarbon emissions. Whoosh; we're all gone.
It's wishful thinking, I feel, that we somehow remain coherent as an energy being after our physical demise, able to manage our direction, our intents, our communications. It's also arrogant to imagine ourselves that important.
As well, there is absolutely NO incontrovertible evidence for this except in the writings of the bible (by scientifically illiterate peasant prophet/profiteers) or in the imaginations of Tarot card and palm readers the world over. (But hey, we all gotta make a living, no?)
We are not so much "made up of energy", Ever_L; we're made up of sub-atomic particles behaving fairly uniformly in accordance with, mostly, Newtonian physics, except when we stray into the larger set of quantum physics.
There are no "particles" . . . just vibratory events.
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It's wishful thinking, I feel, that we somehow remain coherent as an energy being after our physical demise, able to manage our direction, our intents, our communications. It's also arrogant to imagine ourselves that important.
That we imagine is the testament to our importance. You merely described the "after-birth" of the "womb" that carries our "spiritual embryo."
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As well, there is absolutely NO incontrovertible evidence for this except in the writings of the bible (by scientifically illiterate peasant prophet/profiteers) or in the imaginations of Tarot card and palm readers the world over. (But hey, we all gotta make a living, no?)
To the abstraction and philosophically challenged these assertions might apply. YOU are not some amorphous non-existent illusion of "brain functions." What IS a function anyway? Where does it exist? What is it comprised of? YOU are a COMPOSITE of the individual activities ("functions") in the brain . . . like a "melody" is a COMPOSITE of a sequence of notes. The difference is that YOU (unlike a melody) ACT and INTERACT with the universe AS A COMPOSITE . . . not individual "notes" . . . and only a composite consciousness like ours can experience melody as a composite.
There are no "particles" . . . just vibratory events.
Possibly quite true, but we only partially understand (loosely at that) vibratory events. Who really knows; there may be some other reality; we may represent some transient phase-shift point in some ongoing flow of etherial gibberish. Strings, light "particles"; there's a whole lot of speculatin' goin' on 'roun' he-ah, wouldn't you agree?
We haven't given up trying to explain it in terms that the layman or even our not-so-humble selves can grasp, but hey; it just may be out of our reach. Forever. Nevertheless, the end product is still there.
That we imagine is the testament to our importance.
Ooohhhh, Mystic, old chum; this one really bothers me. IMHO and experience, we're not that important; we just want to be! If we'd just accept our humble origins and existance, we'd perhaps not be fighting and killing each other with such veracity and fervour! We could enjoy life, like the penquins, or wolves or snow leopards.
You merely described the "after-birth" of the "womb" that carries our "spiritual embryo." To the abstraction and philosophically challenged these assertions might apply. YOU are not some amorphous non-existent illusion of "brain functions."
Actually, I'm pretty sure that you've described exactly what we humans are. Our particular (and so far, unique) ability to abstract has self-promoted us in a self-aggrandizing sort of un-humble way, to overactively imagined levels of vast Universal import.
I doubt it myself, having seen the vast amounts of damage we've done, both from ignorance, but more importantly of late, with full knowledge of what we're doing. And yet we keep screwing up the world that others must also live in/on.
Now THAT'S truly arrogance, wouldn't you say, Mystic?
What IS a function anyway? Where does it exist? What is it comprised of? YOU are a COMPOSITE of the individual activities ("functions") in the brain . . . like a "melody" is a COMPOSITE of a sequence of notes. The difference is that YOU (unlike a melody) ACT and INTERACT with the universe AS A COMPOSITE . . . not individual "notes" . . . and only a composite consciousness like ours can experience melody as a composite.
I also doubt that. You just have to be tuned in to the larger living universe is all; spend more time in the true unaltered or influenced wilderness to see other worlds, other interactions that are not explained successfully by a chance mythology that's passing through and that tries (quite unsuccessfully for many) to be all things to all people, (as long as they don't ask too many questions, in which case we burn them publicly...) but also puts their self-image, arrogantly, at the top of some imagined heap.
My cats, my chickens and other animals I've met seem to like music, particularly my favorite Mozart pieces. I once set up a speaker system in the Arctic and played Mozart & Beethoven and The Doors to the free-ranging polar bears. I have a photo (I should scan and post it...) of a young "pb" sitting peacefully under the speaker listening to Mozart, eyes slightly closed. They were less interested in The Doors.....
From my knowledgeable perspective & considerable unbiased, un-tainted observations of the biosystems interactions of larger mammals, I nowknow that these animals have hugely similar brain systems to ours, just perhaps lacking that abstracting ability.
Their sense of auditory functionality and presence and melody organization is probably, in many ways, far more developed & sophisticated than ours (whales in the sea, wolves howling, bird songs, and on and on). They may well enjoy "the fine musical stylings of Paul Anka!" as well as we do (well, some of us do; not all...); they just can't make a violin.
It's more that we've evolved (or partially lost) a subset of their abilities, not the other way around. We utilize sound for survival far less than they must.
At any rate, my Apple MAC G4 can listen to my voice and react appropriately. I've even assigned it a pleasant female voice! I hope it shows up in Heaven as well, given it's obvious sentience. I'm pretty sure, though, despite it's friendly and polite demeanor, that it's nothing more than a functional assemblage. Maybe it will be there with legs soz I don't have to lug it around all the time?
Last edited by rifleman; 05-15-2009 at 10:26 AM..
Reason: typoz, humor?
I'm always watching documentaries and I did see one on the structure near Japan. There are tidal forces and the gradual wearing down of rock that have been shown to create uniform looking structures that may appear to be man made at first glance but are really natural formations. I do agree that it's possible that as ocean levels have raised it is quite possible that man made objects were in fact covered by the ocean but what we're not seeing in examples such as this one are detailed carvings such as statues resembling people that would have to have been man made. What we're seeing instead looks like a bunch of blocks and no one has ever proven that this is actually a submerged city.
A recent discovery at the site discovered a massive arch or gateway of huge stone blocks that were beautifully fitted together in a manner similar to the huge stones found among Ica cities.
This without question removes all doubt, and the structure is now believed to be man-made. Also, this structure is 100 feet below the surface. If the oceans of the world could be lowered that much, one would have to assume the globe would look much differently then what we see today. Yet, there is no record of such a drop, and outside of a global flood. Could you explain where all this water came from? Of course, this would still not explain why we have large man-made structures a half mile below the surface off of west Cuba.
Humans did not evolve a soul. Humans were blessed with the Holy Spirit "the Lord and giver of Life". Adam and Eve were the first to know God. And, Humans did evolve. God wanted man to evolve so that he would be humble. For man to know that he is from nature which is from God, but the difference is God so love his creation, mankind, that he sent the Holy Spirit to bless his mind to know the goodness of God's love. God wanted mankind to know that even when man has developed many great scientific discoveries there still is a God so great, so powerful that the mightiest of technologies man has can not thwart God's power.
Humans did not evolve a soul. Humans were blessed with the Holy Spirit "the Lord and giver of Life". Adam and Eve were the first to know God. And, Humans did evolve. God wanted man to evolve so that he would be humble. For man to know that he is from nature which is from God, but the difference is God so love his creation, mankind, that he sent the Holy Spirit to bless his mind to know the goodness of God's love. God wanted mankind to know that even when man has developed many great scientific discoveries there still is a God so great, so powerful that the mightiest of technologies man has can not thwart God's power.
No offense Lionpainter, but I have yet to see "God's power". Prayer does nothing, and don't understand "know the goodness of God's love". That sentence makes no sense to me. Maybe you can explain a little further?? Thank you! Again, no offense intended at all, as my title says, I'm all about learning!
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