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Old 03-27-2009, 09:11 AM
 
Location: New York City
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Romans chapter 1 is often mentioned in a conversation where someone asks, "what about the people who have never heard of God?" Of course, "God" generally means the Christian God. The Christian points out, based on Romans 1, that the heathen is without excuse because he has nature around him to testify that there is a God. How he interprets or views this god is another story, but Romans 1 suggests that the heathen is provided evidence in his environment about God, even the very "Godhead" (some will say, the Trinity) but they reject and suppress this knowledge, this revelation, and willfully set off on a path leading away from God. As a result they make idols based on their corrupted idea of God and thus became darkened in their thinking.

This leads to God allowing them to free fall into all manner of evil, allowing them to do as they please resulting in the basest of human actions. These are the people that the wrath of God will fall upon.

Romans 1 is attributed to Paul and conversely, the book of Acts is in great part about his actions. On a visit to Athens he takes a walk up to Mars Hill and sees the vast inclusion of gods the Greeks worship, even including an "unknown god." Paul recognizes their ignorance and says:

"Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked..." (Acts 17:30)


The question here then is, which one is it. Did God overlook ("wink at") the ignorance of the heathen in times past or were they still without excuse and their ignorance was still not an excuse?
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Old 03-27-2009, 09:42 AM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
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It wasn't until the early 1500s that Christianity was introduced to my people and look what it did, so who's the heathen...
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Old 03-27-2009, 11:17 AM
 
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These are the things that make people dislike Christianity and turn their backs on it.

The fact that you call non-Christians dirty names like "heathen" and say that non-Christians are all damned by God. It's so ridiculous, so simple minded, so primitive.

It's condecsending that you all cannot accept other peoples beliefs. It's ignorant that you cannot open your minds to other paths.

I believe Jesus said "You reap what you sow". And you all are sowing the seeds of fear, ignorance and hate. And the fruits will soon be ripe.
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Old 03-27-2009, 11:26 AM
 
Location: New York City
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Now I am looking at this, what would have happened (and it did) if the "heathen" did acknowledge a "higher power" but imagined it as a big elephant stomping around the heavens? Would he be faulted? What if he wanted more intimacy and made an image of this god and propped it up on a hillside and asked his family or tribe to come talk to it OR selected a special person to go and talk to it for the tribe?
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Old 03-27-2009, 11:37 AM
 
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I think a persons views on God are personal and they should make up their own mind. There should be no dogma telling you what to believe. If you believe dogma about God, then you are simply not being a free-thinker and you are being a sheep.

And no matter what you believe about God, there will be no "fault" at all. The idea of non-believers going to hell is totally primitive. It's just a "with us or against us" attitude with nothing to back it up besides some scriptures. It makes no sense.

A persons beliefs about God simply must be genuine and true to themselves. That's all it takes to create good karma, or sow the seeds of love, or whatever you would like to call it.
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Old 03-27-2009, 11:42 AM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneInDaMembrane View Post
Now I am looking at this, what would have happened (and it did) if the "heathen" did acknowledge a "higher power" but imagined it as a big elephant stomping around the heavens? Would he be faulted? What if he wanted more intimacy and made an image of this god and propped it up on a hillside and asked his family or tribe to come talk to it OR selected a special person to go and talk to it for the tribe?

How about the people that go into a building and worship an image of their savior nailed on a piece of wood or a statue of his mother and have a special person read to them from their sacred book and you have to pay tribute to this individual to have your soul go to your heaven, not much difference there.
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Old 03-27-2009, 02:16 PM
 
7,780 posts, read 14,155,922 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneInDaMembrane View Post
Now I am looking at this, what would have happened (and it did) if the "heathen" did acknowledge a "higher power" but imagined it as a big elephant stomping around the heavens? Would he be faulted? What if he wanted more intimacy and made an image of this god and propped it up on a hillside and asked his family or tribe to come talk to it OR selected a special person to go and talk to it for the tribe?
The bottom line, for me, is that God is just and holy.

Folks that have not heard the gospel of Jesus are judged on something different and their eternal destiny (well, for that matter, mine too) rests solely on God's judgment.....however folks like you and I, have no excuse whatsoever. We've heard the Truth and each of us makes a decision on what we do with that Truth.
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Old 03-27-2009, 02:42 PM
 
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Will someone answer this question please?

Let's say for example, that there is a Hindu or Buddhist. They have heard Jesus' teachings, yet they decided they wanted to take another path.

They live the most pure life imaginable. Their karma is perfect. Basically, they follow the ten commandments fully even though they are on another path and they have done nothing but good in the world.

Are you all really saying that these people are going to burn in hell for eternity?
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Old 03-27-2009, 03:02 PM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
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Originally Posted by FunkyMonk View Post
Will someone answer this question please?

Let's say for example, that there is a Hindu or Buddhist. They have heard Jesus' teachings, yet they decided they wanted to take another path.

They live the most pure life imaginable. Their karma is perfect. Basically, they follow the ten commandments fully even though they are on another path and they have done nothing but good in the world.

Are you all really saying that these people are going to burn in hell for eternity?

FunkyMonk, I do not think I am qualified to answer this question from a Christian perspective, but as I understand it correctly and from what I've been told that that is true, if they do not accept Jesus as their savior and that's what I understand of Christianity and if that is correct, that is what Christians believe, however, I do not believe that is going to happen. You see I do not believe in Christianity's concept of heaven or hell and I'm sure that there are other religions and beliefs that do not believe in that concept either. In my culture we do not have such a belief.
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Old 03-27-2009, 03:05 PM
 
Location: In the North Idaho woods, still surrounded by terriers
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Originally Posted by ptsum View Post
It wasn't until the early 1500s that Christianity was introduced to my people and look what it did, so who's the heathen...

Very true, PT...look what it also did to the Polynesians, the Africans, the Aboriginals...it's really very sad...to take away the beauty of those cultural beliefs and leave such turmoil and destruction in its wake.
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