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Old 08-20-2009, 06:18 PM
 
Location: Bellingham, WA
8,934 posts, read 7,285,561 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
No.......God really does punish people.
*gasp* I actually agree with you. Not the part about God existing, of course, but I could have sworn mention in the Bible of God deciding whether a soul goes to heaven or hell. Hell, of course, being the ultimate punishment. To me, that sounds like God does indeed punish.
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Old 08-21-2009, 07:00 AM
 
Location: Nowhere'sville
2,345 posts, read 2,639,036 times
Reputation: 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terryj View Post
Kind of sounds like Santa Clause, keeping a list and checking it twice, just to see who naughty or nice.

Oh just great Terryj!!! Thanks A LOT! Now that song is going to be stuck in my head all day!!!
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Old 08-21-2009, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
2,903 posts, read 8,082,801 times
Reputation: 1687
Quote:
Originally Posted by stycotl View Post
nice post. you and i differ in some doctrinal beliefs no doubt (show me a pair of people that don't, and i'll show you a pair of people that have never bothered to think about it), but that doesn't mean much in the end, and your philosophy and ability to look at human nature are impressive.

in particular, i enjoyed and heartily agree with this:

one of the few christian existentialists, paul tillich, wrote that many of the people that don't understand this concept are under a self-imposed ignorance because they cannot wrap their heads around the concept of them being wrong and there really being no eternal existence. he says that these people are afraid of a meaningless existence (in the sense that death ends everything), and that they are more often than not the ranks from which the violent, cruel, religious fanatics of the world are pulled.

makes sense too. otherwise, why would there be such a perceived need to become irrationally angry and resentful to the point of hatred and war with others simply because they have different creation stories and different holy books (or none at all)? it is repressed fear and ignorance and nothing more.
I don't think we'd differ in any doctrinal beliefs because i don't have any.
The intellect can only take you so far.
One can use systems and/or doctrine as a support along the way.
The more objectivity one has regarding the limits of a system or doctrine (and the limits of the intellect!!!) the better one is able to use that system as a stepping stone to something more ultimate or real.
At some point one may see that all mental constructs are just that ... mental constructs.
If you can (or do) accept and ultimately grok that the unobscured, unclouded mind is a mirror that reflects what is, well then congratulations. you're on your way to understanding the difference between reality and conceptual reality.
This would be called clear seeing.
What is, is seen / known .... without the overlay of ideas / concepts.
And the illusory nature of phenomenal "reality" is recognized without resulting in nihilism.
In Zen it's the attainment of your original clear mind.
So really, all of this babble (my own included) is just intellectual non-sense and actually, seen from a certain perspective, it's hilarious that people actually fight about doctrine and belief for they are fighting about that which is not even and ultimately real.
Ridiculous! ... or as Bill Maher would say, Religulous! (particularly when, as that film points out, this insane fighting over religious belief just may end up destroying life as we know it! Boom!)

Something like that.

Last edited by coyoteskye; 08-21-2009 at 02:53 PM..
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Old 08-24-2009, 06:09 PM
 
24 posts, read 29,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
He's patient, waiting for you to repent.

Or maybe he's just adding up the tab, and he'll get you someday.
Yeah, what a "nice" god, trying to make my death as horrible and as gruesome
as possible. There are to many contradictions in your religions.
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Old 08-24-2009, 06:21 PM
 
24 posts, read 29,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaniMae1 View Post
Ah yes. He's adding it all up and will get all us bad people someday. Just the quality I am looking for in a loving woderful father-like god. "Do as I say or burn forever..." What a guy.
Yeah, I know what you're saying. Is "God" like those stories parents tell children so they don't do things? "Don't make that face it'll get stuck that way",
"Don't be be bad or you'll get coal for Christmas from a fat laughing guy in red", "Worship "God" and pray for forgiveness, otherwise he'll kill you in a terrible way and put you in an underground torture chamber for all eternity". Which of those sounded the crackiest? Also, "God" gives Jesus special treatment, that's favoritism!
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Old 08-24-2009, 06:24 PM
 
24 posts, read 29,530 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PassTheChocolate View Post
Have you never experienced adversity? Are you totally and completely happy? Somewhere, somehow, I believe we all pay for our mistakes. If it hasn't happened yet, I'm pretty sure it will. It doesn't have to be God, it's just a reality of life. And it doesn't have to be extreme to be significant.
It's not that, it's just not as huge of unhappiness as people make you think.
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Old 08-25-2009, 06:34 AM
 
4,512 posts, read 4,705,122 times
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^let this x-imp prove on mental grandeur and the taboos of an eon first, fwiw.
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Old 08-25-2009, 06:58 AM
 
Location: Texas
1,296 posts, read 1,212,110 times
Reputation: 672
Well, whether I like it or not, I'm sure something not so pleasant will happen to me (and YOU too!) sooner or later. I won't blame God for it, though, it's just a matter of probability and time.
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Old 08-25-2009, 07:14 AM
 
Location: home
1,041 posts, read 766,373 times
Reputation: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamplight View Post
*gasp* I actually agree with you. Not the part about God existing, of course, but I could have sworn mention in the Bible of God deciding whether a soul goes to heaven or hell. Hell, of course, being the ultimate punishment. To me, that sounds like God does indeed punish.

Since the beginning of time, God, Our Father, has given great opportunity for life. Throughout, all of time God, has existed, and so has His Wrath. God does not like punishing mankind. Now, that is not to say that bad things do happen to us through the process of nature. We're tied to nature like a baby tied to the umbilical chord of his mother.

When mankind is ready to except the truth about origin and the terms laid out for life, then that's when we make progress. Progress, in God, progress in Jesus Christ. Progress in New Civilizations.

Man is far behind, not in as much as machines that we have created, but in Spirit and Faith. Through Spirit and Faith man creates new opportunity. Gain from a harvest vested in Christ. That He shared His blood so that sin may be forgiven once, but this Christ has passed through hell and gained eternal life, gained eternal knowledge of the Father, gained faith to live as the Son.

Punishment comes when you blaspheme the Lord God, Our Father. You blaspheme the Father, by rejecting the Son, you blaspheme the Holy Spirit by not acknowledging life and how precious life is. Life is Beautiful, hence My Creations.

Punishment comes when man destroy's his fellow man for power and money.

Punishment never comes when mankind has made God, Our Father, our Truth. And, Jesus Christ, our Mediator, our Teacher, and in both hold the Spirit for We are One.

Last edited by Lionpainter; 08-25-2009 at 07:23 AM..
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Old 08-25-2009, 11:35 AM
 
24 posts, read 29,530 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lionpainter View Post
Since the beginning of time, God, Our Father, has given great opportunity for life. Throughout, all of time God, has existed, and so has His Wrath. God does not like punishing mankind. Now, that is not to say that bad things do happen to us through the process of nature. We're tied to nature like a baby tied to the umbilical chord of his mother.

When mankind is ready to except the truth about origin and the terms laid out for life, then that's when we make progress. Progress, in God, progress in Jesus Christ. Progress in New Civilizations.

Man is far behind, not in as much as machines that we have created, but in Spirit and Faith. Through Spirit and Faith man creates new opportunity. Gain from a harvest vested in Christ. That He shared His blood so that sin may be forgiven once, but this Christ has passed through hell and gained eternal life, gained eternal knowledge of the Father, gained faith to live as the Son.

Punishment comes when you blaspheme the Lord God, Our Father. You blaspheme the Father, by rejecting the Son, you blaspheme the Holy Spirit by not acknowledging life and how precious life is. Life is Beautiful, hence My Creations.

Punishment comes when man destroy's his fellow man for power and money.

Punishment never comes when mankind has made God, Our Father, our Truth. And, Jesus Christ, our Mediator, our Teacher, and in both hold the Spirit for We are One.
"God, our father" has a certain son named Jesus, who's the favorite. Also to you people saying Santa's like God, you're wrong. Santa (switch the n)=Satan/The Devil. They both live under extreme weather conditions, they're both large, they both wear red, and they both punish those who are bad. Listen to Jingle Bells with that in mind...
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